Yarrawonga passenger service

 
  kitchgp Chief Commissioner

2 x crews per day, based where?

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  justarider Chief Commissioner

Location: Released again, maybe for the last time??
Also why would crewing be expensive for 6 trips ? All that is a required is a driver for the train no conductor necessary ?
freightgate
Built on the premis of using a single car Sprinter, we presume?

No evidence that a Sprinter can be converted to SG, nor whether it is economic to do so.
  freightgate Minister for Railways

Location: Albury, New South Wales
Yarrawonga and mulwala have a combined population of 10000 people more than Maryborough. Swan hill is similar in size.

Where is the passenger service and why not create local jobs there with the yard available for servicing and maintenance and parking if trains.
  BrentonGolding Chief Commissioner

Location: Maldon Junction
Also why would crewing be expensive for 6 trips ? All that is a required is a driver for the train no conductor necessary ?
freightgate
Do V/Line currently operate any passenger services without a Conductor?

I reckon hell will freeze over before the RTBU lets that happen

Thin edge of the wedge and all that
  Djebel Junior Train Controller

Also why would crewing be expensive for 6 trips ? All that is a required is a driver for the train no conductor necessary ?
Do V/Line currently operate any passenger services without a Conductor?

I reckon hell will freeze over before the RTBU lets that happen

Thin edge of the wedge and all that
BrentonGolding
If Railpage had been around 40 years ago, people would have said the same about guards on Melbourne trains.  Yet the last guard disappeared 25+ years ago.
  Gman_86 Chief Commissioner

Location: Melton, where the sparks dare not roam!
Also why would crewing be expensive for 6 trips ? All that is a required is a driver for the train no conductor necessary ?
freightgate
Do V/Line currently operate any passenger services without a Conductor?

I reckon hell will freeze over before the RTBU lets that happen

Thin edge of the wedge and all that
Brenton Golding

Nobody with actual influence is going to choose that hill to die on just to get a train to Yarrawonga up.

If Railpage had been around 40 years ago, people would have said the same about guards on Melbourne trains. Yet the last guard disappeared 25+ years ago.
Djebel
Yet V/Line trains still must run with conductors. V/Line won't even let a heritage train run on its tracks without one of their conductors on board, so conductors aren't going anywhere. In particular, they are not going so they can introduce a new 3 times per day train between Benalla and Yarrawonga.

I would bet my house on that.

Yarrawonga and mulwala have a combined population of 10000 people more than Maryborough. Swan hill is similar in size. Where is the passenger service and why not create local jobs there with the yard available for servicing and maintenance and parking if trains.
freightgate


There are 2 major obstacles to get over:

1. Potential passenger numbers.

Just parroting that Yarrawonga-Mulwala has an equal population to X which does have a passenger rail service isn't the same thing as proving that there are sufficient potential passenger numbers to justify the spend on a train over the current road coach. If it did work that way, Mildura would have a train about now.

2. Rollingstock availability.

There currently is no available spare rollingstock to run this proposed train. This isn't like extending more Ballarat trains to Ararat or Maryborough, or more Bendigo trains to Echuca, those trains already exist, they are just being terminating further down the line. Seymour and Shepparton are the terminus locations for that line, to send trains to Yarrawonga will require purpose built vehicles. N Class and N sets are already past their used by date and V/Line want to get them off the North East line ASAP, so that option is not available (not to mention it would be overkill to send a 4 car N set to Yarrawonga anyway).

There is a big question mark over whether or not Sprinters can even be converted to run on SG, so that leaves us with 2 options, either V/Line purchase used rail cars from NSW, or they build more new SG Vlocities. Either way you are talking millions of dollars. To justify this you are going to need good proof of the potential for high levels of patronage.
  kitchgp Chief Commissioner

One of the reasons I ask is account the persistent notion I have for a Yarrawonga service replacing the slow and rough bus service from Benalla to Yarrawonga.  One of the reasons I ask is account the persistent notion I have for a Yarrawonga service replacing the slow and rough bus service from Benalla to Yarrawonga.  ………………………..
bevans, Albury V/Line after conversion services? thread
The coach takes about 70 mins with stops at Goorambat, Devenish, St James and Tungamah. In the 1975 Timetable, the DERM did it in the same time, with an additional optional stop at Telford. There doesn’t seem to be much left of these stations, save a few platform mounds. There would be significant costs restoring passenger facilities at these locations.

A lot of expense to save 10 minutes. The business case would have to be based on significantly increased passenger numbers. A single Sprinter would not provide much more capacity than a coach. Presumably, if there are additional Albury services, there will be additional connecting Yarrawonga (Mulwala) coaches.
  kitchgp Chief Commissioner

A past quote from woodford (in another thread):

“Goninan operators manual for the Sprinters in section 2.2 VEHICLE DIMENSIONS AND SPECIFACTIONS states.....

Track Gauge.................................................................1600 mm
     convertable [sic] to.......................................................1435 mm

------------------------------end quote---------------------"



DRCs 42 & 43 were converted from SG to BG.
  BrentonGolding Chief Commissioner

Location: Maldon Junction
Also why would crewing be expensive for 6 trips ? All that is a required is a driver for the train no conductor necessary ?
Do V/Line currently operate any passenger services without a Conductor?

I reckon hell will freeze over before the RTBU lets that happen

Thin edge of the wedge and all that
If Railpage had been around 40 years ago, people would have said the same about guards on Melbourne trains.  Yet the last guard disappeared 25+ years ago.
Djebel
If Dan Andrews had been around 25+ years ago I doubt we would have seen the same result. More likely 2 guards per train (1 per carriage set maybe?) and a mobile trolley serving Coke and crisps staffed by RTBU Conductor Grade employees on every service Laughing
  The Vinelander Minister for Railways

Location: Ballan, Victoria on the Ballarat RFR Line
Yarrawonga and mulwala have a combined population of 10000 people more than Maryborough. Swan hill is similar in size.

Where is the passenger service and why not create local jobs there with the yard available for servicing and maintenance and parking if trains.
freightgate

Swan Hill is effectively 70,000 people. You forget about the elephant in the room.

M.
  Upven Junior Train Controller

Yarrawonga and mulwala have a combined population of 10000 people more than Maryborough. Swan hill is similar in size.

Where is the passenger service and why not create local jobs there with the yard available for servicing and maintenance and parking if trains.

Swan Hill is effectively 70,000 people. You forget about the elephant in the room.

M.
The Vinelander
How is it effectively 70,000 people when the Rural City of Swan Hill council area has only around 21,000 and the Murray River Council area in NSW has barely 12,000.
  The Vinelander Minister for Railways

Location: Ballan, Victoria on the Ballarat RFR Line
Yarrawonga and mulwala have a combined population of 10000 people more than Maryborough. Swan hill is similar in size.

Where is the passenger service and why not create local jobs there with the yard available for servicing and maintenance and parking if trains.

Swan Hill is effectively 70,000 people. You forget about the elephant in the room.

M.
How is it effectively 70,000 people when the Rural City of Swan Hill council area has only around 21,000 and the Murray River Council area in NSW has barely 12,000.
Upven

Indeed...posters who don't know their geography.

I knew Mildura is booming as the numbers of new houses going up is stunning to see, but even I was WAY out in my guesstimation.

For the unitiated...or those posters who don't travel beyond the Myki fare zones, Mildura sits in Victoria's north west....growing way more than I realised.

https://www.vline.com.au/getattachment/19e67ce6-d5ed-47df-a94e-4b673448e6cf/Mildura-Melbourne-(via-Swan-Hill-and-Bendigo)

Moreover, if you are travelling on one of V/Line's around FOUR services a day from Swan Hill to Mildura...you first have to change trains at Swan Hill.

http://www.population.net.au/mildura-population/#:~=The%20city%20is%20famously%20known,end%20of%20June%20of%202021.

Therefore added to Swan Hills population:

https://www.planning.vic.gov.au/__data/assets/pdf_file/0013/11704/Swan_Hill_VIF_2016_One_Page_Profile_Output.pdf

Over 100,000 people are served by the Swan Hill V/Line service BEYOND Bendigo.

Mike.
  Nightfire Minister for Railways

Location: Gippsland
Yarrawonga and mulwala have a combined population of 10000 people more than Maryborough. Swan hill is similar in size.

Where is the passenger service and why not create local jobs there with the yard available for servicing and maintenance and parking if trains.

Swan Hill is effectively 70,000 people. You forget about the elephant in the room.

M.
How is it effectively 70,000 people when the Rural City of Swan Hill council area has only around 21,000 and the Murray River Council area in NSW has barely 12,000.
Upven
People are counting population catchment.

But the real bolometer Is public transport demand, not a solution looking for a problem.

Oh look Greater Adelaide has 1.35 Million people, that should be a public transport service every half hour to and from Melbourne !  
Reality, It gets 1 return public transport service a day along with numerous other commercial passenger services.
  Djebel Junior Train Controller

Yarrawonga and mulwala have a combined population of 10000 people more than Maryborough. Swan hill is similar in size.

Where is the passenger service and why not create local jobs there with the yard available for servicing and maintenance and parking if trains.

Swan Hill is effectively 70,000 people. You forget about the elephant in the room.

M.
How is it effectively 70,000 people when the Rural City of Swan Hill council area has only around 21,000 and the Murray River Council area in NSW has barely 12,000.
People are counting population catchment.

But the real bolometer Is public transport demand, not a solution looking for a problem.

Oh look Greater Adelaide has 1.35 Million people, that should be a public transport service every half hour to and from Melbourne !  
Reality, It gets 1 return public transport service a day along with numerous other commercial passenger services.
Nightfire
There probably is,   but it terminates at Tullamarine instead of SCS..  Just because it's not a bus or train doesn't mean it's not public transport.
  Upven Junior Train Controller

Yarrawonga and mulwala have a combined population of 10000 people more than Maryborough. Swan hill is similar in size.

Where is the passenger service and why not create local jobs there with the yard available for servicing and maintenance and parking if trains.

Swan Hill is effectively 70,000 people. You forget about the elephant in the room.

M.
How is it effectively 70,000 people when the Rural City of Swan Hill council area has only around 21,000 and the Murray River Council area in NSW has barely 12,000.
People are counting population catchment.

But the real bolometer Is public transport demand, not a solution looking for a problem.

Oh look Greater Adelaide has 1.35 Million people, that should be a public transport service every half hour to and from Melbourne !  
Reality, It gets 1 return public transport service a day along with numerous other commercial passenger services.
Nightfire
The population catchment isn't calculated by just drawing a circle around a station though, and even if it were it wouldn't go 150+ kilometres in the direction of Mildura.
  railblogger Chief Commissioner

Location: At the back of the train, quitely doing exactly what you'd expect.
It doesn't matter how large the population of a town is. What matters is the demand going from A to B. After all, why provide a service that doesn't get used?
  The Vinelander Minister for Railways

Location: Ballan, Victoria on the Ballarat RFR Line
Yarrawonga and mulwala have a combined population of 10000 people more than Maryborough. Swan hill is similar in size.

Where is the passenger service and why not create local jobs there with the yard available for servicing and maintenance and parking if trains.

Swan Hill is effectively 70,000 people. You forget about the elephant in the room.

M.
How is it effectively 70,000 people when the Rural City of Swan Hill council area has only around 21,000 and the Murray River Council area in NSW has barely 12,000.
People are counting population catchment.

But the real bolometer Is public transport demand, not a solution looking for a problem.

Oh look Greater Adelaide has 1.35 Million people, that should be a public transport service every half hour to and from Melbourne !  
Reality, It gets 1 return public transport service a day along with numerous other commercial passenger services.
Nightfire

Adelaide is a furphy, for starters it's in another state, which as we know is no friend of regional PT.

We are talking intrastate PT. Moreover, if nobody was travelling by V/Line to Mildura, there wouldn't be as many services as there currently are.

Importantly, trains are travel enablers...buses for the most part, particularly for people who are aged or who have a disability are for a number of reasons an impediment to travel. Consequently as its population increases, Yarrawonga and other localities along the Murray are setting themselves up for improved PT in whatever form that may take.

Mike.
  Nightfire Minister for Railways

Location: Gippsland
.
There probably is,   but it terminates at Tullamarine instead of SCS..  Just because it's not a bus or train doesn't mean it's not public transport.
Djebel
The most commonly used commercial passenger transport does terminate at Tullamarine, but direct commercial road coach services do terminate at SCS (there were 4 a day back In 2019) VLine runs via a train connection at Bendigo with a Ararat train connection available at Horsham.

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