The East West Link, a question

 
  John.Z Assistant Commissioner

The coalition have announced the EWLINK is now back on their policy agenda.  

Has it occurred to many this is flogging a dead horse when considered the coalition took this to two loosing elections?
Elections don't decide one issue.

Was the last election a referendum on increasing train frequencies? Because this current Labor government doesn't give two sh!ts about increasing train frequencies outside of peak hours,

HELLOOoo Exclamation

An astounding 40 minute off peak train service here since January.

M.
The Vinelander
Congratulations on your upgrade from 60mins to 40mins. God. Talk about celebrating the scraps.

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  The Vinelander Minister for Railways

Location: Ballan, Victoria on the Ballarat RFR Line
The coalition have announced the EWLINK is now back on their policy agenda.  

Has it occurred to many this is flogging a dead horse when considered the coalition took this to two loosing elections?
Elections don't decide one issue.

Was the last election a referendum on increasing train frequencies? Because this current Labor government doesn't give two sh!ts about increasing train frequencies outside of peak hours,

HELLOOoo Exclamation

An astounding 40 minute off peak train service here since January.

M.
Congratulations on your upgrade from 60mins to 40mins. God. Talk about celebrating the scraps.
John.Z

Shall I post a link to a V/Line timetable from a few short years ago when the Ballarat line was served by about 8 trains a day...one on average about every 2 HOURS Exclamation

And the last train from Melbourne to Ballarat was around 21:30 and even earlier on weekends.

So yes...the Ballarat line, timetable wise, is extremely happy with the service frequency we receive. So perhaps before making broad statements, you might like to consider the facts first.

Sorry...not sorry to burst your bubble. Smile

Mike.
  Gman_86 Chief Commissioner

Location: Melton, where the sparks dare not roam!
So the Liberal party are still obsessed with this project. 2 failed election campaigns with this as their ace in the hole policy and they seem to think it will work a 3rd time.

Are we going to see a resurgence of the brain-fart that was the grade seperation of 50 road intersections as well?
  Upven Junior Train Controller

So the Liberal party are still obsessed with this project. 2 failed election campaigns with this as their ace in the hole policy and they seem to think it will work a 3rd time.

Are we going to see a resurgence of the brain-fart that was the grade seperation of 50 road intersections as well?
Gman_86
Well to be fair they're not aiming to win the seats in which this is most unpopular; the inner city. I'm still surprised by the number of weird bumper stickers I see out east that are for it.
  John.Z Assistant Commissioner


Shall I post a link to a V/Line timetable from a few short years ago when the Ballarat line was served by about 8 trains a day...one on average about every 2 HOURS Exclamation

And the last train from Melbourne to Ballarat was around 21:30 and even earlier on weekends.

So yes...the Ballarat line, timetable wise, is extremely happy with the service frequency we receive. So perhaps before making broad statements, you might like to consider the facts first.

Sorry...not sorry to burst your bubble. Smile

Mike.
The Vinelander
No bubble to burst mate. I'm still fascinated by the fact that you think 40min service to Ballarat is adequate, or a meaningful upgrade from 60. Should be every 20 minutes at least, same as Bendigo. Maybe if they hadn't ripped up all the tracks during RFR that would be possible.

8 trains per day is a low base, but I'm sure that was in the 90s.
  Lockie91 Assistant Commissioner

So the Liberal party are still obsessed with this project. 2 failed election campaigns with this as their ace in the hole policy and they seem to think it will work a 3rd time.

Are we going to see a resurgence of the brain-fart that was the grade seperation of 50 road intersections as well?
Well to be fair they're not aiming to win the seats in which this is most unpopular; the inner city. I'm still surprised by the number of weird bumper stickers I see out east that are for it.
Upven
Bang on, it is all to do with Sandbagging the few seats they have left, which just goes to show how desperate they are.

EWL starts in Richmond, Labor 5.46% (EWL is only going to help labor in this seat), Kew (Tim Smith) 4.78%, Bulleen (Matthew Guy) 5.77%, Warrandyte (Ryan Smith) 3.88%, Croydon (David Hodgett) 2.11%. All on thin ice and at risk of being lost in 2022. Then there is the Labor seats that they lost in 2018 that they would be hoping to swing back. Box Hill 2.10%, Ringwood 2.82%, Hawthorn 0.42% and Bayswater 0.39%.

They couldn't possibly bring back the road in its original form, there would have to yet another business case. The ironic thing about all of this is the original business case showed that road wasn't going to help any of these people. Majority of traffic from the east was going down Hoddel Street towards the City, not cross town to City Link.

Also of note, is the SRL will be about to begin construction through the eastern suburbs just as the election rolls around, with a 'super hub' station being constructed in the middle of Michael O'Briens seat. Along with the North East Link, being built through Matthew Guys seat.

More irony is this is the complete opposite in the West, a dud road project that is billions over budget and only promises for rail projects.

Lockie
  Djebel Junior Train Controller

If the EW link is built as a true inner city bypass (linking the Eastern Fwy, Citylink, WRR, and Western Hwy only) it would take a lot of pressure off the only existing cross-city freeway corridor.  Probably still wouldn't stack up as a business case but they'd probably close and tear up the entire rail system in Victoria if it were solely up to the bean counters Rolling Eyes.
  BrentonGolding Chief Commissioner

Location: Maldon Junction
I did not mean to offend.

I am working on the code here and wanted to participate in a discussion.  I think the EWLINK would take a way funding from rail transport projects.
8502
No offence taken here, IMO you did the right thing in posting to this thread as opposed to opening a new one for a topic already being discussed (despite the fact that RP frowns on such things)

I would offer that this whole thread should probably be in Other Transport and not Melbourne Suburban but that ship has probably sailed

Oh, and welcome aboard the Railpage Express (Stopping All Stations) service. Expect a rough ride at times and who knows, we may even get to our destination one day Laughing
  Gman_86 Chief Commissioner

Location: Melton, where the sparks dare not roam!
Anybody who has driven down the Eastern Fwy during the AM peak will know: 70% of traffic travelling on the Eastern, West of the Chandler Hwy exit take the Hoddle St exit. Of the remaining 30%, half turn off Alexander Pde at any of Wellington St, Smith St, Brunswick St, Nicholson St, Rathdowne St, Lygon St (shall I go on) and none of these options will be available from any East West Link tunnel, forcing a lot more cars onto Hoddle St.

This will leave approximately 15% of the current traffic coming off the Eastern Fwy actually heading into this new tunnel.

Add to that, the Andrews Govt's North East link (which is already under construction and will be well advanced by next years election) will provide a real connection from the outer Eastern suburbs to the Outer Northern and Western suburbs, as well as Tullamarine Airport, giving even less need for the East-West link.

I could swear the LNP's addiction to this project is nothing more than petty stubbornness and spite based on them being cheesed off at Andrews following through on his promise in 2014 to rip up the contract.
  Tii Locomotive Driver

Anybody who has driven down the Eastern Fwy during the AM peak will know: 70% of traffic travelling on the Eastern, West of the Chandler Hwy exit take the Hoddle St exit. Of the remaining 30%, half turn off Alexander Pde at any of Wellington St, Smith St, Brunswick St, Nicholson St, Rathdowne St, Lygon St (shall I go on) and none of these options will be available from any East West Link tunnel, forcing a lot more cars onto Hoddle St.

This will leave approximately 15% of the current traffic coming off the Eastern Fwy actually heading into this new tunnel.

Add to that, the Andrews Govt's North East link (which is already under construction and will be well advanced by next years election) will provide a real connection from the outer Eastern suburbs to the Outer Northern and Western suburbs, as well as Tullamarine Airport, giving even less need for the East-West link.

I could swear the LNP's addiction to this project is nothing more than petty stubbornness and spite based on them being cheesed off at Andrews following through on his promise in 2014 to rip up the contract.
Gman_86
Seems it might be more prudent to look where those 70%. of traffic on Hoddle street are heading to ? Collingwood, Richmond , inner city etc- or trying to head further down south to somewhere. I wonder if Hoddle street might be better as the tunnel in some future form if most are heading to Punt road and beyond if traffic doesn't reduce.
  kitchgp Chief Commissioner

Brisbane’s Clem Jones Tunnel went broke. Sydney’s Cross City Tunnel went broke twice. Both due to excessive traffic volume forecasts.

An indicator of the likely traffic volume for the tunnel is that Macarthur Road, which forms part of the current link between the Eastern Freeway and CityLink (at Flemington), is a two-lane road. No mention of what the toll will be.
  Carnot Minister for Railways

I reckon the NE link will also never breakeven.  And at more than $1 million per metre, yet another impending monumental financial failure to bankrupt Victoria.
  historian Deputy Commissioner

Anybody who has driven down the Eastern Fwy during the AM peak will know: 70% of traffic travelling on the Eastern, West of the Chandler Hwy exit take the Hoddle St exit. Of the remaining 30%, half turn off Alexander Pde at any of Wellington St, Smith St, Brunswick St, Nicholson St, Rathdowne St, Lygon St (shall I go on) and none of these options will be available from any East West Link tunnel, forcing a lot more cars onto Hoddle St.

This will leave approximately 15% of the current traffic coming off the Eastern Fwy actually heading into this new tunnel.

Add to that, the Andrews Govt's North East link (which is already under construction and will be well advanced by next years election) will provide a real connection from the outer Eastern suburbs to the Outer Northern and Western suburbs, as well as Tullamarine Airport, giving even less need for the East-West link.

I could swear the LNP's addiction to this project is nothing more than petty stubbornness and spite based on them being cheesed off at Andrews following through on his promise in 2014 to rip up the contract.
Gman_86

I would suggest that the EWL was never about providing access to the airport.

The giveaway was the inclusion of a section between Royal Park and Dynon duplicating CityLink. This indicates that they expected most of the EWL traffic to turn south at Royal Park, not north to the airport.

I believe that the fundamental purpose of the EWL was to give the middle and senior managers living in Doncaster/Bulleen and surrounding areas easy access to the western end of the city, particularly the Docklands. Over the last 20 years an awful lot of big corporates have moved from the central and eastern end of the CBD to the west, which must have seriously affected (road) commutes from the NE.

Note that the EWL would have indeed reduced the traffic in the north/south roads to the north east of the CBD, as people bound for the western end of the city would have used the EWL to get to their jobs. If you want to be cynical, you could suspect that this, in fact, explains why access to the north/south roads would be restricted in the EWL as it would strongly encourage people to use the full length of the EWL to access their jobs in the western half of the CBD.

You might also notice that the West Gate Tunnel project is *exactly* the same project, except that it improves access to the western end of the city from the Western suburbs, not the North Eastern suburbs.
  John.Z Assistant Commissioner


You might also notice that the West Gate Tunnel project is *exactly* the same project, except that it improves access to the western end of the city from the Western suburbs, not the North Eastern suburbs.
historian
To be more precise, the West Gate Tunnel was formerly known as East West Link stage 2 when the Brumby Government released the Eddington Plan. Instead of building it from Clifton Hill, they've built it from newport.

Hmm, that sounds like something else that could be built soon...........

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