Murray Basin standardisation

 
  bevans Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia
Hmm anyone up to bailing up Dopey Jacinta again? Cos this is another no brainer that's been put on the never-never. Cos that means replacing track that V/line want's gone! I'm wondering if someone did something to the Armstrong Street bridge that inhibits double tracking? As that Ballarat Station carpark the users of almost need a shuttle bus for, certainly blocks triple tracking.
ARodH

Please explain what track V/Line wants gone?

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  ARodH Chief Train Controller

Location: East Oakleigh, Vic
Hmm anyone up to bailing up Dopey Jacinta again? Cos this is another no brainer that's been put on the never-never. Cos that means replacing track that V/line want's gone! I'm wondering if someone did something to the Armstrong Street bridge that inhibits double tracking? As that Ballarat Station carpark the users of almost need a shuttle bus for, certainly blocks triple tracking.

Please explain what track V/Line wants gone?
bevans
To me, it looks like any double track in the Ararat-Melbourne corridor
  freightgate Minister for Railways

Location: Albury, New South Wales
Who cares what V/line want do what is required for passenger benefit.
  BigShunter Chief Commissioner

Location: St Clair. S.A.
The 40 minute Off Peak frequency is not the issue as claimed and Government knew of it as it planned the sg line through Ballarat it was well aware of the promised 40 minute Off Peak frequency.
The key issues are improving the infrastructure immediately on either side of Ballarat so sg & bg freight trains can use the 30 minute window through Ballarat taht occurs in each 40 minute Off Peak cycle.  Simply done basically dual gauge Maryborough to Ballarat North Junction, and dual gauge Gheringhap to Hummfray Street at Up end of Ballarat Yard.
Resore bg crossover at Warrenheip so Melb trains can also use South Line.  Restore second track between Lydiard Street and North Ballarat Junction.  South track as bg, North track as sg only. Then Centre Line through Ballarat station  becomes standard gauge only.  Platforms remain as bg only.  Broad gauge through freight trains use platform 1 to/from South Track,  standard gauge trains use Centre Road.  This can all be done with two powered gauge splitters, 3 mixed gauge diamonds, and the crossover from the broad gauge North Line at Warrenheip to the dual gauge South Line.
The current arrangement at Ballarat is a fool of a layout dicated by some number cruncher or person with limited if any rail operational experience. Currently the North line sees over 60 pass trains on Weekdays , whilst the South line averages 3 !!!  With Up and Down Wendouree trains crossing at Ballarat any late running on the Down automatically condemns the Up to late departure from Ballarat. By simply re-instating the crossover at Warrenheip creates a 6 km double track broad gauge section, allowing Ups to depart Ballarat on time via the South Line to Warrenheip in the event of late running on the Down .   The claim it cannot be done is a smokescreen for saying I just don't want to have sg freight trains of that nightmare Murray Basin Project running through Ballarat.  
Before 1995 we had much greater numbers of freight trains all on broad gauge from the Wimmera, Adelaide and Maryborough all passing through Ballarat with double track from Warrenheip right through to Linton Junction.  Agressive track rationalization at Ballarat by VLP to save maintenance costs, plus removal of connections at Warrenheip and closure of two crossing loops at Sulky and Tourello have crippled train through put at Ballarat.  Easily fixed as outlined above incorporating the already funded loop restoration at Tourello.
kuldalai
Thanks for the informative post kuldalai, the above and the situation you have given us regarding passenger trains in another thread, through Ballarat is quite a mess isn't it.
I need some track layout plans and some colored lines of what is happening and what needs to happen to visualise this.

Would you have an approximate costing on the job to enable the freight to get through Ballarat or can the passenger side of it be sorted and then allowing the freight side of it to be done when someone has got the knackers to finally do it ?

Seems like a fairly big carrot dangling here for the Opposition Gov't to jump in, that is if there's enough brains there to see what needs doing and deal with this ( successfully ). It would be a win win situation of passengers as well as the floundering freight trains.

BigShunter.
  kuldalai Chief Commissioner

Don,t have an idea of what a through Ballarat freight line as outlined would cost at this stage.  Unfortunately Government has removed all refrence from the web as to the project formerly called the Ballarat Gauge Separation Project which would have given an indicative costing .

The thing is the Government doesnt hesitate to give an endless flow of capex for road upgrades both in Metro and Regional, but screams like a stuck pig for the Feds to fund the larger part of anything rail especially in country Victoria. Viz:  RRR projects, MB rail works etc.
  james.au Minister for Railways

Location: Sydney, NSW
Don,t have an idea of what a through Ballarat freight line as outlined would cost at this stage.  Unfortunately Government has removed all refrence from the web as to the project formerly called the Ballarat Gauge Separation Project which would have given an indicative costing .

The thing is the Government doesnt hesitate to give an endless flow of capex for road upgrades both in Metro and Regional, but screams like a stuck pig for the Feds to fund the larger part of anything rail especially in country Victoria. Viz:  RRR projects, MB rail works etc.
kuldalai
IIRC, Ballarat Gauge Separation was the Freight Passenger Rail Separation Project, and it was broadly allocated $130m.  But there was never a business case or something formal that showed any detail about the project.  I think it died in the VLine/RPV development process somewhere.

https://www.constructionadvisor.com.au/130-million-freight-passenger-rail-separation-project-announced-for-ballarat/
  freightgate Minister for Railways

Location: Albury, New South Wales
There is still I think double track to the west of Ballarat almost to the bee Ballarat west intermodal terminal. What more double track would be required ?
  Lockspike Chief Commissioner

There is still I think double track to the west of Ballarat almost to the bee Ballarat west intermodal terminal. What more double track would be required ?
freightgate
No. Only the remnants of the former Sth line remain, between Doveton St and Gillies St.
  bevans Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia
What at a guess would be the annual tonnages on the Mildura Line please?
  Carnot Minister for Railways

A wild guess:
3 trains per week
40 wagons per train
56T loaded per wagon

= 350000T per annum.
  Lachlan's Train Channel Chief Train Controller

Location: probably taking a photo of 7901V
A wild guess:
3 trains per week
40 wagons per train
56T loaded per wagon

= 350000T per annum.
Carnot
My guesstimate:
The heaviest trains would be around 4,000t total on up to 65 wagons (1200m). Maximum axle loading is 19tal atm, after the Avoca line is re railed it will be 21tal.
Most of the time the mentioned 4000t number is not the case though. at a rough average of 2500t per train at an average of say 2.5 trains per week, that's 325,000t p/a
  YM-Mundrabilla The Ghost of George Stephenson

Location: Mundrabilla but I'd rather be in Narvik
If two and a half to three trains a week is all that is possible that is an appalling situation. All concerned should hang their heads in shame before being sacked.

Surely there is someone with a positive outlook who is not prepared to accept the status quo and who is prepared to 'have a go'.
  Bonzel Junior Train Controller

It`s not a main interstate line , traffic on this line depends on seasonal agri products so its up and down like a yo yo now since no oil or cement has been on rail to Mildura in over a decade or longer.
  Lachlan's Train Channel Chief Train Controller

Location: probably taking a photo of 7901V
It`s not a main interstate line , traffic on this line depends on seasonal agri products so its up and down like a yo yo now since no oil or cement has been on rail to Mildura in over a decade or longer.
Bonzel
Pretty sure the cement is now containerised from Merbein
  bevans Site Admin

Location: Melbourne, Australia
It`s not a main interstate line , traffic on this line depends on seasonal agri products so its up and down like a yo yo now since no oil or cement has been on rail to Mildura in over a decade or longer.
Pretty sure the cement is now containerised from Merbein
Lachlan's Train Channel

Where is it loaded in Melbourne?
  Lachlan's Train Channel Chief Train Controller

Location: probably taking a photo of 7901V
It`s not a main interstate line , traffic on this line depends on seasonal agri products so its up and down like a yo yo now since no oil or cement has been on rail to Mildura in over a decade or longer.
Pretty sure the cement is now containerised from Merbein

Where is it loaded in Melbourne?
bevans
No idea. just that it's now containerised
  Donald Chief Commissioner

Location: Donald. Duck country.
CLF2, 44204, S311, 48s36 & CLF4  did a trip to Birchip today.
  Carnot Minister for Railways
  Tii Chief Train Controller

Hmmmm....
https://vic.nationals.org.au/media-releases/ministers-excuses-leave-murray-basin-rail-project-under-a-fresh-cloud-of-doubt/

The PAEC website hasn't released the transcript yet for the June 6th stoush, but I'm sure it'll be juicy.
https://www.parliament.vic.gov.au/paec/article/4880
Carnot
a saga that will run as long as Neighbours.
  Carnot Minister for Railways

Hmmmm....
https://vic.nationals.org.au/media-releases/ministers-excuses-leave-murray-basin-rail-project-under-a-fresh-cloud-of-doubt/

The PAEC website hasn't released the transcript yet for the June 6th stoush, but I'm sure it'll be juicy.
https://www.parliament.vic.gov.au/paec/article/4880
a saga that will run as long as Neighbours.
Tii
But that's about to finish. I hear the last episode is will be screened in September.

Anyway, the Murrayville-Ouyen section upgrade appears to have been completed (now 40 km/h line speed - woohoo!!), and new rail continues to be dropped off between Ararat and Maryborough so that will help.

I do have my doubts about the rest of it though, particularly the new loops and Dunolly Yard improvements if the new Fed Govt pulls the pin completely.
  james.au Minister for Railways

Location: Sydney, NSW
Hmmmm....
https://vic.nationals.org.au/media-releases/ministers-excuses-leave-murray-basin-rail-project-under-a-fresh-cloud-of-doubt/

The PAEC website hasn't released the transcript yet for the June 6th stoush, but I'm sure it'll be juicy.
https://www.parliament.vic.gov.au/paec/article/4880
Carnot
Ping us when the transcripts are up
  Donald Chief Commissioner

Location: Donald. Duck country.
The replaced siding in the Donald yard must be super special.  Work has been going on for about 6 weeks now.  
For one loop that was taken out when the gauge conversion went through.
  Bonzel Junior Train Controller

The replaced siding in the Donald yard must be super special.  Work has been going on for about 6 weeks now.  
For one loop that was taken out when the gauge conversion went through.
Donald
What have they done in that time?
  Tii Chief Train Controller

a saga that will run as long as Neighbours.
But that's about to finish. I hear the last episode is will be screened in September.

Anyway, the Murrayville-Ouyen section upgrade appears to have been completed (now 40 km/h line speed - woohoo!!), and new rail continues to be dropped off between Ararat and Maryborough so that will help.

I do have my doubts about the rest of it though, particularly the new loops and Dunolly Yard improvements if the new Fed Govt pulls the pin completely.
Carnot
40!! that's it after all this time?  Ok a freight train doesn't have to run at TGV speed but you'd think for efficiency it might be a tad higher. Is the funding for what was already announced in the revamped/descoped project under the Federal/State arrangement already allocated, so that part can be completed at least ?
  Tii Chief Train Controller

Hmmmm....
https://vic.nationals.org.au/media-releases/ministers-excuses-leave-murray-basin-rail-project-under-a-fresh-cloud-of-doubt/

The PAEC website hasn't released the transcript yet for the June 6th stoush, but I'm sure it'll be juicy.
https://www.parliament.vic.gov.au/paec/article/4880
a saga that will run as long as Neighbours.
But that's about to finish. I hear the last episode is will be screened in September.
Carnot
LOL- I guess I meant it might take as long as 37 years to complete (sort of/in some way/with bits/left out/put in/changed/rescoped/upgraded/high vis......

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