Renewable energy thread 2022

 
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
So they are lying and you just go head and parent their bull$hit about building all these coal power stations they are actually not.

When will you fact check your own references, when Don when?

Don, there are other ways to reference and fact check what a country is doing other than believing what you read on "conspiracy_theory_R_US.com"
Didn't even try to deny that they're lying - again, good to see we're making progress here.
don_dunstan
Don, the only one lying is you.

Lying to us, lying to yourself.

If you want to talk facts, then feel free to continue, if you want to talk conspracy theories, then try the wall.

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  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
Wooohoooo! - BHP to close New South Wales' largest coal mine in 2030.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2022-06-16/bhp-to-close-largest-coal-mine-in-nsw/101157404

don_dunstan will be choking on his Corn Flakes this morning Razz
Nobody else will ever take over, right Bing?
don_dunstan
Did you read it?

BHP has had it on the market for 2 years, no taker.

Its current product sale price is $400/t, but no one wants to buy the mine.

It will take 10-15 years to rehab the site. Up there with nuclear power stations.

After rehab costs are factored in the estimated value of the mine is near $0 (BHP words not mine).

it will at this stage operate until closure around 2030 when likely further operation will require major investment to expand the pit and/or upgrade the plant.

Could someone take over it? Potentially, but it doesn't look positive.
  don_dunstan Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Adelaide proud
So they are lying and you just go head and parent their bull$hit about building all these coal power stations they are actually not.

When will you fact check your own references, when Don when?

Don, there are other ways to reference and fact check what a country is doing other than believing what you read on "conspiracy_theory_R_US.com"
Didn't even try to deny that they're lying - again, good to see we're making progress here.
Don, the only one lying is you.

Lying to us, lying to yourself.

If you want to talk facts, then feel free to continue, if you want to talk conspracy theories, then try the wall.
RTT_Rules
You have nothing do you, RTT_Rules. Lost harder than Jimmy Carter on this as well as the "Qantas should get corporate welfare thing".

"conspiracy" not "conspracy"
  don_dunstan Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Adelaide proud
South Australia's windmills fall over - yet again. Tonight they're supplying only 2% of our total energy needs - that's after a few days of really stellar performance in which windmills supplied almost all our energy needs (hooray!). But tonight the wind has dropped off and they're supplying sweet FA, in fact gas is doing the heavy lifting at 90% - (awwww!). Dirty old diesel engines are having to do 9% spewing carbon monoxide into the atmosphere because windmills cant' cut the mustard. As usual. And filthy gas doing 89% - filthy, dirty gas!!

If we relied mostly on those windmill things we'd all have to go to bed early with cold dinner... but then maybe that's the future, hey. Crapping in a hole in the ground and living without electricity.
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
South Australia's windmills fall over - yet again. Tonight they're supplying only 2% of our total energy needs - that's after a few days of really stellar performance in which windmills supplied almost all our energy needs (hooray!). But tonight the wind has dropped off and they're supplying sweet FA, in fact gas is doing the heavy lifting at 90% - (awwww!). Dirty old diesel engines are having to do 9% spewing carbon monoxide into the atmosphere because windmills cant' cut the mustard. As usual. And filthy gas doing 89% - filthy, dirty gas!!

If we relied mostly on those windmill things we'd all have to go to bed early with cold dinner... but then maybe that's the future, hey. Crapping in a hole in the ground and living without electricity.
don_dunstan
More lies

Lastly, an extensive literature review produced no scientifically reported cases of fatal CO poisoning attributed to diesel fuel exhaust.

For thsoe who don't know, Don drives a ~25 year old car which is more polluting than a modern diesel stationary engine with scrubbers.

Tasmania produced 50% more power than SA last night, so really SA's output is so small I'm surprised AEMO doesn't just merge it with Vic like ACT is with NSW.
  don_dunstan Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Adelaide proud
More lies

Lastly, an extensive literature review produced no scientifically reported cases of fatal CO poisoning attributed to diesel fuel exhaust.

For thsoe who don't know, Don drives a ~25 year old car which is more polluting than a modern diesel stationary engine with scrubbers.

Tasmania produced 50% more power than SA last night, so really SA's output is so small I'm surprised AEMO doesn't just merge it with Vic like ACT is with NSW.
RTT_Rules
It's small because we were forced by stupid people to have windmills and almost nothing else. Stupid, small-minded bigots who have no idea about how much of a problem this causes for the people who actually live here.

And diesel produces poisonous carbon dioxide in abundance, which you're against. Remember?
  The Vinelander Minister for Railways

Location: Ballan, Victoria on the Ballarat Line
It's well past time to close this ridiculous thread down. No one else is contributing to the thread which served its purpose many pages ago.

M.
  don_dunstan Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Adelaide proud
South Australia's windmills fall over - yet again. Tonight they're supplying only 2% of our total energy needs - that's after a few days of really stellar performance in which windmills supplied almost all our energy needs (hooray!). But tonight the wind has dropped off and they're supplying sweet FA, in fact gas is doing the heavy lifting at 90% - (awwww!). Dirty old diesel engines are having to do 9% spewing carbon monoxide into the atmosphere because windmills cant' cut the mustard. As usual. And filthy gas doing 89% - filthy, dirty gas!!

If we relied mostly on those windmill things we'd all have to go to bed early with cold dinner... but then maybe that's the future, hey. Crapping in a hole in the ground and living without electricity.
More lies

Lastly, an extensive literature review produced no scientifically reported cases of fatal CO poisoning attributed to diesel fuel exhaust.

For thsoe who don't know, Don drives a ~25 year old car which is more polluting than a modern diesel stationary engine with scrubbers.

Tasmania produced 50% more power than SA last night, so really SA's output is so small I'm surprised AEMO doesn't just merge it with Vic like ACT is with NSW.
RTT_Rules
It's not even 20 years old - so wrong again, RTT_Rules.

And your evidence is fallacious, I never said anyone died from carbon dioxide poisoning from diesel generators that's just another herring.

You're losing this whole thing again five ways from Sunday, meanwhile South Australia is losing what few manufacturing jobs we have left thanks in part to the rush to stupid green energy.
  don_dunstan Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Adelaide proud
It's well past time to close this ridiculous thread down. No one else is contributing to the thread which served its purpose many pages ago.

M.
The Vinelander
Translation: Don Dunstan is running rings around the argument that green energy is better.

Again, you're welcome to join the debate any time you want, Mike, but the problem is that you don't understand anything about the thing that you so dearly believe in and therefore can't advocate for it. At least RTT_Rules is having a go - you on the other hand like a typical Teal voter have no clue what we're even talking about.
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
It's not even 20 years old - so wrong again, RTT_Rules.

And your evidence is fallacious, I never said anyone died from carbon dioxide poisoning from diesel generators that's just another herring.

You're losing this whole thing again five ways from Sunday, meanwhile South Australia is losing what few manufacturing jobs we have left thanks in part to the rush to stupid green energy.
don_dunstan
It will be by the time you finish posting in this thread and close your freezer door.

South Aust was loosing manufcaturing jobs for 40 years before the first ever wind turbine was erected. What littler you have left isn't leaving because you have the lowest wholesale power prices in 15 years. They are leaving because why would you set up a manufacturing base in SA?
  don_dunstan Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Adelaide proud
It's not even 20 years old - so wrong again, RTT_Rules.

And your evidence is fallacious, I never said anyone died from carbon dioxide poisoning from diesel generators that's just another herring.

You're losing this whole thing again five ways from Sunday, meanwhile South Australia is losing what few manufacturing jobs we have left thanks in part to the rush to stupid green energy.
It will be by the time you finish posting in this thread and close your freezer door.

South Aust was loosing manufcaturing jobs for 40 years before the first ever wind turbine was erected. What littler you have left isn't leaving because you have the lowest wholesale power prices in 15 years. They are leaving because why would you set up a manufacturing base in SA?
RTT_Rules
If you keep up this deliberate baiting off-topic I will report you. Likewise if I catch you changing my posts again when you reply to me I will also report you: 13/6/2022 1:47pm on this thread:
My contribution to this discussion is an insult.
don_dunstan

I don't care if this makes me a dobber, I'm sick to death of you and Mike trying deliberately to bait me when you're losing an argument in an attempt to get me banned from this board. Either argue your case properly or leave.
  The Vinelander Minister for Railways

Location: Ballan, Victoria on the Ballarat Line
I don't care if this makes me a dobber, I'm sick to death of you and Mike trying deliberately to bait me when you're losing an argument in an attempt to get me banned from this board. Either argue your case properly or leave.
don_dunstan

Arguing the case.

This should permanently shut down the Representative from SA's fears about the ongoing and inevitable transition to renewables. We have a new, progressive federal government and supportive state and territory governments of renewable energy so EVERYONE is now on the same page...save of course for the Representative from SA and the far right news outlets.

From this morning's news, 17/6/2022.

  • Speaking to morning television earlier today, Albanese says his plan to upgrade the energy transmission system and invest in battery storage is the certainty businesses need to invest in clean energy. He said it was important private business saw this as an “opportunity to drive new jobs, new industries”.
Any further opposing discussion is baseless dog whistling. So, common sense now prevailing, perhaps it's time to put this thread permanently to bed.

But of course, the Representative from SA and common sense are many miles apart, as we shall probably see.

Mike.
  Valvegear Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Banned
But of course, the Representative from SA and common sense are many miles apart, as we shall probably see.
"The Vinelander"
I wonder what percentage of the population's views he actually represents.
  don_dunstan Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Adelaide proud
Arguing the case.

This should permanently shut down the Representative from SA's fears about the ongoing and inevitable transition to renewables. We have a new, progressive federal government and supportive state and territory governments of renewable energy so EVERYONE is now on the same page...save of course for the Representative from SA and the far right news outlets.

From this morning's news, 17/6/2022.

Speaking to morning television earlier today, Albanese says his plan to upgrade the energy transmission system and invest in battery storage is the certainty businesses need to invest in clean energy. He said it was important private business saw this as an “opportunity to drive new jobs, new industries”
The Vinelander
See, the fundamental problem here is that you haven't made any effort to construct an argument at all. In fact all you've done is parrot a press release from the Albanese government telling us that they're going to stay on track with this renewables garbage because they don't have a plan B in case it doesn't work out. And it's not working out - and they don't have a plan B.

And what you're basically saying is that governments never, ever made policy mistakes because they've thrown their weight behind this thing - and if we look at the past we can see history is absolutely littered with policy errors that didn't emerge as such until much later. Our own Commonwealth government allowed and/or promoted the following:
  • Maralinga and Montebello Islands nuclear test ranges;
  • Forcibly removing children from un-wed mothers;
  • Aboriginal people not being counted as actual "people" until the 1967 referendum;
  • Kevin Rudd's disastrous NBN - tens of billions spent on something that's been rendered largely obsolete by 5G and geostationary satellites. Something like fifty billion taxpayer dollars down the drain.
  • Cancelled French submarines;
  • A litany of foreign policy mistakes including going into Iraq and Afghanistan; supporting brutal, repressive governments world-wide because they meet our short-term or economic interests.
But according to your logic, governments never, ever make mistakes like the one they're making now. Right? That's primarily the argument that you're using here.

Any further opposing discussion is baseless dog whistling. So, common sense now prevailing, perhaps it's time to put this thread permanently to bed.
The Vinelander
So contact David Head or one of the moderators and tell them that you don't like this thread - explain to them what your reasons for not liking it are, and see what kind of a reception you get. Don't try and brow-beat me into not posting about the ludicrous nature of this pursuit of an illusive "net zero" nirvana because:
  • It's technically impossible and can't work on our island nation.
  • The UK and Germany PROVE that it can't work - not without access to cheap and reliable nuclear electricity from France.
  • Batteries and pumped hydro are not economically feasible, nor can pumped hydro be sited anywhere anyway because the greens themselves won't let us do it.
Renewables can't rise to the task and provide power at times when the grid most needs it (ie at night) because we can never store electricity on the scale that will be required.

So all this is just posturing to try and appease the Teals and Greens - and every dollar thrown into it is just a throwing good money after bad. But by all means keep trying to get this thread shut down because you don't agree with it. All it does is draw attention to the fact that you have nothing whatsoever as a counter-point and you want to take your bat and ball home.
  don_dunstan Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Adelaide proud
High gas prices kill yet another business - this time in regional Victoria where one of the few remaining brickworks has closed forever - ABC;

Regional businesses are beginning to buckle under the pressure of unaffordable power as Australia's gas crisis continues to bite.

In the Victorian town of Stawell, about 230kms north-west of Melbourne, local manufacturer Advance Bricks is shutting after more than 82 years in business.

Managing director John Collins says the company, which employs 23 people, could no longer afford the power bill after the collapse of commercial gas supplier Weston Energy in late May forced it onto a plan with "retailer of last resort" Energy Australia.

Mr Collins said the company, one of the town's biggest employers, went from paying $6-to-$8 a gigajoule of gas to more than $37 a gigajoule overnight, and that no other gas retailers were able to supply the brickworks because Energy Australia was the only other retailer that had access to the gas pipeline.

"The assertion by (Victorian) Premier Andrews and (federal) Minister Bowen that heavy industries can transition to renewable energy is complete and utter fantasy," he said.

Local Nationals MP Anne Webster said she feared a "rolling tsunami of closures of businesses at the very time when we are needing manufacturing to pick up in Australia".

Green energy is destroying thousands of jobs in this country - but it has its vehement supporters like Albo as The Vinelander says, so the transition to a job-free future is more or less guaranteed. We won't have any heavy industry or manufacturing left in this country whatsoever once the "transition" is made.
  don_dunstan Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Adelaide proud
But of course, the Representative from SA and common sense are many miles apart, as we shall probably see.
I wonder what percentage of the population's views he actually represents.
Valvegear
You have at least half a brain from what I've seen, you must be able to see the enormous problems this "transition" is causing our economy. It's bad enough that Hawke/Keating made the decision to off-shore most of our manufacturing, now we have this insane push to unreliable and heavily subsidised energy sources hobbling business in this country on top of compulsory superannuation, payroll tax, the extreme cost of housing and real-estate etc etc.

This will not end well for our country, there won't be any jobs whatsoever left at all for the hand-to-mouth working class with the exception of serving coffee to the bureaucrats, we need to call this "green" energy out for what it is - a complete waste of money and a job-destroyer.
  lsrailfan Minister for Railways

Location: Somewhere you're not
But of course, the Representative from SA and common sense are many miles apart, as we shall probably see.
I wonder what percentage of the population's views he actually represents.
You have at least half a brain from what I've seen, you must be able to see the enormous problems this "transition" is causing our economy. It's bad enough that Hawke/Keating made the decision to off-shore most of our manufacturing, now we have this insane push to unreliable and heavily subsidised energy sources hobbling business in this country on top of compulsory superannuation, payroll tax, the extreme cost of housing and real-estate etc etc.

This will not end well for our country, there won't be any jobs whatsoever left at all for the hand-to-mouth working class with the exception of serving coffee to the bureaucrats, we need to call this "green" energy out for what it is - a complete waste of money and a job-destroyer.
don_dunstan
I tend to agree with you, again, it's all well and good to make this transition if we have the equipment to do so, but we have nowhere near enough to make the switch from Coal to green energy currently. it does seem a bit "pie in the sky stuff".
  The Vinelander Minister for Railways

Location: Ballan, Victoria on the Ballarat Line
Blackout warnings lifted.

https://www.theage.com.au/politics/federal/blackout-warnings-lifted-for-weekend-as-national-cabinet-weighs-up-energy-solutions-20220617-p5aum7.html

How did you go with the Honda generator and the additional shovels for the bunker Question

How's life in the echo chamber...a bit lonely hey Question

M.
  don_dunstan Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Adelaide proud
Blackout warnings lifted.

https://www.theage.com.au/politics/federal/blackout-warnings-lifted-for-weekend-as-national-cabinet-weighs-up-energy-solutions-20220617-p5aum7.html

How did you go with the Honda generator and the additional shovels for the bunker Question

How's life in the echo chamber...a bit lonely hey Question

M.
The Vinelander
Awesome! And all we had to do to achieve that was suspend the electricity market, compel power generators to run at a loss and then pass those losses straight to the users - the poor old hapless Australian electricity consumer. Isn't it great?

So much for cutting the cost of electricity - a promise broken in less than a month of government.
  don_dunstan Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Adelaide proud
Barack Obama orders an enormous series of propane tanks for his ocean-side holiday home at Martha's Vineyard - ZeroHedge;



Earlier this month, the town of Edgartown, Massachusetts received an application for an underground propane tank installation at Obama's estate, consisting of two 1,000 gallon-tanks and one 500-gallon tank, to be used for "residential purposes."

“We’ve never had a private propane tank come to us,” said a member of the town's review board. Typical residential storage for back-up generators is 100 to 500 gallons.

At a time when his successor's economic war on Russia is wreaking havoc on the world and the U.S. economy teeters on the edge of an abyss, Obama's 2,500-gallon scheme suggests he wants his 6,900-square-foot, seven-bedroom house to be ready for many weeks of energy independence at a time.  

Now there's someone who obviously doesn't believe in the ability of renewables to power his lifestyle, right? I wonder what he knows that the rest of us don't...
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
If you keep up this deliberate baiting off-topic I will report you. Likewise if I catch you changing my posts again when you reply to me I will also report you: 13/6/2022 1:47pm on this thread:
My contribution to this discussion is an insult.

I don't care if this makes me a dobber, I'm sick to death of you and Mike trying deliberately to bait me when you're losing an argument in an attempt to get me banned from this board. Either argue your case properly or leave.
don_dunstan #1 supporter of Putin
Took you long enough to see that.

I've never tried to get you or anyone else banned Don, nor reported.

Don, you are the most gulity for going off-topic at the slightest hint of the truth against your agenda. Data is presented, you don't like, you say they are lying. Then you go and post something from some agenda driven website that no one has ever heard of and half the time you havn't even fully read it yourself.

Topic is RE, what did the SA Premier annouce a day or two back. SA's RE / gas mix will not support the failure in the east coast coal generation.

Anyway, challenge accepted.
  don_dunstan Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Adelaide proud
If you keep up this deliberate baiting off-topic I will report you. Likewise if I catch you changing my posts again when you reply to me I will also report you: 13/6/2022 1:47pm on this thread:
Took you long enough to see that.
RTT_Rules
No, I saw it, I just stewed on it for a while before bringing it up. And you're doing it again.

Just stop it, you're not a child. Or are you?
I've never tried to get you or anyone else banned Don, nor reported.
RTT_Rules
No, but you love resorting to insults when you're losing.
Data is presented, you don't like, you say they are lying.
RTT_Rules
What data? I said those Asian countries were lying about not building more coal-fired capacity. And they are.
Topic is RE, what did the SA Premier annouce a day or two back. SA's RE / gas mix will not support the failure in the east coast coal generation.
RTT_Rules
The present Premier is so busy show-boating and taking selfies I'm surprised he even knows there's a power crisis going on.
  The Vinelander Minister for Railways

Location: Ballan, Victoria on the Ballarat Line
Blackout warnings lifted.

https://www.theage.com.au/politics/federal/blackout-warnings-lifted-for-weekend-as-national-cabinet-weighs-up-energy-solutions-20220617-p5aum7.html

How did you go with the Honda generator and the additional shovels for the bunker Question

How's life in the echo chamber...a bit lonely hey Question

M.
Awesome! And all we had to do to achieve that was suspend the electricity market, compel power generators to run at a loss and then pass those losses straight to the users - the poor old hapless Australian electricity consumer. Isn't it great?

So much for cutting the cost of electricity - a promise broken in less than a month of government.
don_dunstan

Yeah...continue the dog whistling...that's all you have left.

I may be back in a few days but honestly, I don't know why Shane bothers. The discussion has been won by the progressives and the regressive coal lovers can eat cake.

M.
  don_dunstan Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Adelaide proud
Yeah...continue the dog whistling...that's all you have left.
The Vinelander
You've made no serious attempt to even participate in this conversation apart from cut/pasting press releases from our new government about how they're going to double down on this madness. From what I've seen you lack the capacity to critically evaluate information on your own.
I may be back in a few days but honestly, I don't know why Shane bothers. The discussion has been won by the progressives and the regressive coal lovers can eat cake. M.
The Vinelander
You've won absolutely nothing. Just because some agenda is the flavour de jour doesn't mean it won't go out of fashion one day and you'll be standing there naked (ugh...) like all the other "progressives" who arrogantly thought they were right about bankrupting the country with unreliable power.
  lsrailfan Minister for Railways

Location: Somewhere you're not
Blackout warnings lifted.

https://www.theage.com.au/politics/federal/blackout-warnings-lifted-for-weekend-as-national-cabinet-weighs-up-energy-solutions-20220617-p5aum7.html

How did you go with the Honda generator and the additional shovels for the bunker Question

How's life in the echo chamber...a bit lonely hey Question

M.
Awesome! And all we had to do to achieve that was suspend the electricity market, compel power generators to run at a loss and then pass those losses straight to the users - the poor old hapless Australian electricity consumer. Isn't it great?

So much for cutting the cost of electricity - a promise broken in less than a month of government.

Yeah...continue the dog whistling...that's all you have left.

I may be back in a few days but honestly, I don't know why Shane bothers. The discussion has been won by the progressives and the regressive coal lovers can eat cake.

M.
The Vinelander
Sorry to say mate but I think Coal will be powering this country for years to come, you just cannot make the switch to renewables just like that, you need certain technologies like solar farms, wind farms etc etc, we don't have a lot of them around at the moment, they will take years to come online.

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