No, Don wasn't correct. There were recorded deaths from Omicron at the time, just not yet in Oz as it had barely entered the country.

First, Don’s post from December was referring to Australia so was correct at the time.

Second, Don was comparing the severity of Omicron to Delta, and his post was basically correct in that regard and remains so. Omicron is far less deadly than Delta, even among the elderly and infirm. Do you disagree?

Third, do people die of Omicron, or with it?

Fourth, we aren’t debating the December  post. We’re debating the more recent post about Trudeau. You cited the December post as evidence that Don was previously mistaken about COVID, which is irrelevant to correctness of his post about Trudeau.  So even if I concede (which I don’t) that Don’s December post was wrong, it still doesn’t get you anywhere.   It still doesn’t prove, and in fact disproves, your contention that he is anti-vax and thinks the vax was never effective.

In other words, you are still wrong.

I quoted Don correctly, only you and Don here disagree.

You think we need a vote to decide that?  You used different words than Don used. End of story.

The rest of your commentry lacks substance and relevence.

Will deal with this separately.

However
- BOTH OF YOU clearly do not understand the difference between vaccination and immunisation apart from some poor attempt to quote Wiki.

Translation: you won’t accept an authoritative definition and description of the difference between immunisation and vaccination. I didn’t just quite some wiki, I quoted healthdirect.gov.au, a joint website of all state and federal health departments to give accurate information about health issues to all Australians. You are not disagreeing with me, you are disagreeing with the entire medical establishment.

- BOTH OF YOU have completely ignored and refused to comment on my comment that Don IS ANTI VAX because he does not promote or support the use of any CV-19 vaccine and I left the door open for Don to make his position clear but refused.

No I showed you by your own evidence that Don is not anti-VAX and does not claim that the vaccine never worked.

So any further discussion on this is completely mute until Don declares is position he is either Anti Vax or Pro Vax and his vaccination status.

You see the world purely in black and white. And you don’t know which one is which. He could be anti, pro, neutral, or something else. And nor should you be demanding his health information.

And he has clarified his position - he’s not anti-vax (which I already showed you). So once again, your point is disproven.  You lose.

Probably a bit like yourself who took 3 pages responding with all sorts of stories before directly to a simple yes/no on abortion.

You comprehensively lost that whole argument, and now you’re lying about it.

I was asked a question. I explained why it was irrelevant and the wrong question. Nevertheless, I answered it immediately, and then due to continued persistence from your side, another four times. That I answered the question has been admitted. My answer was never referred to in any response, except to complain that the answer was not relevant.  So your side effectively admitted that I was right when I said the question was not relevant.  But the real problem for your side was that the answer wasn’t the one you all expected - it was one you couldn’t rationally disagree with.

And somehow that reflects poorly on me?

You lost that argument so hard that you ran away. You were so illogical you ended up arguing against yourself. The demographic data (which you selectively quoted but refused to link to) disproved your point completely. Your opinion was out of step with 94% of the Australian population.

Stop lying.

Yes you can be pro vax and still not get the vax for underlying health reasons or believe its not critical for you to get it.

Once again, OVER TO YOU DON!

Once again, all your points are comprehensively disproven.

But no doubt you will completely ignore the above and start your next post with “One more time…”, like it proves something.

Enough lies.

Take a leaf from Aaron’s book, and know when to quit.

The rest of your commentry lacks substance and relevence.

I’ve answered all of your arguments with substantive logic and evidence, as demonstrated below, highlighted in bold below as a reminder.  So my commentary does not lack substance.

So if my commentary lacks relevance, it can only be because the arguments I’m responding to  are irrelevant. Which they are.

So when you say my commentary lacks relevance, you are in fact saying that your arguments are irrelevant.

Once again, you think you’re scoring a point, but it’s another own goal.

It's you that's stuck in 2020.  The vax was effective then, it's not nearly as effective now.  COVID was a very serious disease then, now it's much less serious.  You say so yourself later in your post.

That was Don's point.  A point you agree with, but are arguing against. DDS.

Australia opened up, people came in with the virus and it spread. However the vaccine reduced the impact and enabled mostly business as usual without the hospitals being pushed to tipping point.

Yes - notice your use of past tense.

Its relevent because both you and Don appear to be the only two people left on the planet who didn't get the memo. You are not immunised against CV-19, simply you have a vaccination, not immunisation. If you get measles, you are basically immunised against a repeat infection, if you get CV you are not immunised against a repeat infection.

Immunised means => Immune. You are not immue to getting CV-19, just far less likely to get sick, heal faster if you do and less likely to need medical assistance or wake up dead. Do we need to explain this a 10th time or are we good now?

No, you don't seem to know what those words mean, or how to use them.  Vaccination is the term used for getting a vaccine — that is, actually getting the injection or taking an oral vaccine dose. Immunisation refers to the process of both getting the vaccine and becoming immune to the disease following vaccination.  All forms of immunisation work in the same way. When someone is injected with a vaccine, their body produces an immune response in the same way it would following exposure to a disease but without the person getting the disease. If the person comes in contact with the disease in the future, the body is able to make an immune response fast enough to prevent the person developing the disease or developing a severe case of the disease.

And it's all irrelevant anyway.  All of us agree that the vaccine is not effective at preventing COVID any more.  And the difference the vax currently makes to the absolute chance of getting hospitalised is about 0.04%.

No, they did not, they said you are vaccinated against it, they never said you are immune from it. Don referred to measles or Hep, its not the same, it never was.

So you agree with me that you were wrong when you said:

"2) No one has ever, ever stated you will be vacinated against CV-19".  

Arguing against yourself again.

Omicron is less deadly and less likely to leave you in hospital or with Long CV. The CDC data reflects this change and that much of the world are now vaccinated and that many people have had CV more than once which is itself a further vaccination, medical treatment for CV has improved dramatically and of course over 6m people who were supseptiable to CV, have actually died and many others now take ongoing precautions against it.

I'm not agreeing with Don, you only think that because you have not correctly read what he said and I replied.

No, I've correctly read what he said and what you replied.  What you are saying is the same as the point he was making.  You are agreeing with him but can't admit it to yourself due to your DDS.

The only point of actual disagreement is that you aren't taking the p!$$ out of Trudeau.

Becasue Don is rarely right on anything CV. He said early on No one had died from Omicron, well that didn't work out. Should I continue with further examples?

As I recall, he said no one but the old or infirm had died from Omicron.  Which is basically right, I think.

You haven't given any examples of him being wrong, so giving "further" examples is not technically possible.

If you don't understand why people who are immino compromosed are more at risk of getting CV and getting sicker than CV , then might be time to Google. Don, you or I know the medical background of the Canadian PM.

So you just speculate that Trudeau is immunocompromised to justify your argument?

If we were done on the topic, there was no need to respond with questions.

Are we done now?

I thought the questions would highlight for you that you were being illogical again.  Unfortunately you didn't seem understand, but perhaps that was too much to ask of someone with such a severe case of DDS.

I think we are done, though.  I think it was Bill Murray who said, "It's hard to win an argument with a smart person, but it's damn near impossible to win an argument with RTT_Rules".

I still manage, though.  With your help, that is.

Sono, can you at least give me something of substance ?

What does that mean? Are you asking me to write something you're able to disagree with?

So far you've either ignored or agreed with everything I've said.  I'm really not clear what you are disagreeing about. The person you've disagreed with most here is yourself.

Don's point.
"Canadian PM has had CV twice despite 4 vaccinations => "the needles do not work" period. Which has written in such a way and based on his past BS to imply the CV-19 vaccine doesn't work to all. We know Don wanted to make a point on this implying to all Vaccines as why would anyone be bothered to even make this post? Unless of course you are an anti-vaxer. Others observed and made similar comments.

As Don pointed out, you've misquoted him here and relied on the misquote to construct your argument.

You're saying here that he implied that the vaccine doesn't work at all, and that he's anti-vax.  As is your habit, you prove yourself wrong later in your post.

Don and YOU have refused to acknowledge
1) The PM may have underlying health issues.
2) When was the PM's last booster
3) The vaccine effectiveness declines with time
4) The vaccine is not actually immunisation against CV-19, never was, never stated as such, not actual capable of doing so and you will not find any documentation by those qualified to say so.
5) Even with the usual vaccines for Measles etc, there are still a small number in the population whose immune system does not respond or respond well to the vaccine. Also happens with CV-19 vaccine.
6) No one with suitable qualification ever said you WILL NOT GET CV-19 if you get vaccinated. Simply less likely to have symptons, less severe symptons, less recovery time, less likely to end up in hospital and less likely to end up dead. Clearly with less around issues, you are less likely to pass it on and the hence the infection rate went down.
7) The current sub variants of Omicron are likely more resistant to any vaccine that was issued in 2021. Its like the flu, $hit changes hence you need a new shot each year.
8) Even the Gold standard of Pifzer was only given about 9 -12mth worth shelf life in your body as the vaccine works differently to chickenpox vaccine for which you aquire actual immunity be retaining the virus in your body for life. With Corona type viruses such as flu, cold etc, you don't the body kills it and removes it from your system and therefore over time it declines

Some of those points are wrong, some pure speculation, and some not in dispute.  But it doesn't matter, I could acknowledge all of those points and it still doesn't get you anywhere.  

Don's point was that the vax did not work to prevent Trudeau from getting COVID, twice.  None of those acknowledgements change that.  They just reinforce the fact that the vaccine doesn't work that well anymore.  You agree with that too.

So what is your problem with Don's post?  You agree with it. DDS?

What Don said about Omicron was
"Omicron has killed less people than Alec Balwin", at the time it wasn't 100% true and now its very much not 100% true. Please get your facts straight.

Not sure how many times this needs to be all stated and you argue back for the sack of arguing.

This another own goal from you.

Here's the relevant conversation:

I'm gob-smacked that you (and many others on that thread) are still insisting the entire population should be wearing face nappies when:

• All the evidence says the new and more dominant variant is equivalent to a common cold
• The population of NSW is 93.5% 'double dosed'.

Do you seriously want to live like that forever? It's your choice to wear masks everywhere for the rest of your life - but don't force everyone else to do it you paranoid loony.

- don_dunstan

Don’t worry Don. Us New South Welshman are a sharing type. Gold standard in fact.
Facial nappies headed your way, preferable to intubation?
You’ll be participant in the experiment soon.

- michaelgm

Omicron has killed less people than Alec Baldwin - even the traditional obese-and-very-old co-morbidity cohort isn't dying from it. It's the variant we've been waiting for so we can get back to normal. But people on that thread are still - STILL - wanting everyone to hide under their beds as if its 100% fatal. Anyway I don't intend to hijack yet another thread so let's just get back to energy...

- don_dunstan

That exchange took place on 23 December 2021.  The first death from (or should I say "with") Omicron in Australia was recorded four days later.  So when he wrote it, Don was 100% correct.

Second, note that Don cites the vaccination rate and the lower severity of Omicron as a reason not to wear a mask forever. That means he acknowledges the vax was effective and was not against people getting vaxed.

So we all agree the vax didn't work for Trudeau, the vax is less effective against Omicron than it was against Delta, and that Omicron is more contagious but not as severe.  It's also clear from the very comment you cited that Don isn't anti-vax.

That kills every single point you were trying to make.  

There's plenty more you got wrong in your arguments in this discussion, many of which I've pointed out before.  But those arguments are not only wrong, they are irrelevant, so I'm not going to bother re-hashing those issues.  You'll ignore them anyway.

Which still leaves the question - what are you on about?

So when you say my commentary lacks substance and relevance, what you mean is that you can't disagree.

Quit. You’ve lost. You should be embarrassed.

And get some help for your DDS.

Watch out representative from SA and the other anti-vaccers lurking in these pages. COVID may not be done with you yet.

https://www.theage.com.au/national/who-are-the-victorians-dying-from-coronavirus-this-year-20220630-p5ay3m.html

Almost three quarters of the more than 2000 Victorians who have died this year after contracting coronavirus had not received their third dose of the COVID-19 vaccine.

The new state government data comes as Australia inches closer to its 10,000th death.

Mike.

Covid is still circulating in large numbers in the country, there is a call to bring masks back into certain areas, I would agree fully with this, if they brought them back into major supermarkets I think it would be a good idea, (I wear them regardless).

Nah. Absolutely useless it's a one time use N95 mask.

Forget about it.

I use my KN95 masks several times. It is just for shopping, the longest has been for classical concerts (3 hours last Saturday night). I think some took them off while seated but everyone wore them entering and leaving. I only removed mine to eat an ice cream at interval but I ate away from other people as far as possible. Everyone in the queue to buy was wearing them. It is still compulsory inside public buildings here in Aotearoa/NZ.
I am flying to Australia for a month next Monday and have packed 30 masks. My sister in Sydney tells me she always wears them in supermarkets.

BA.5 wave. Cue the panic merchants and bedwetters.

Nah:

BA.5 wave. Cue the panic merchants and bedwetters.

Nah:

Is a masculine ego simply a preventative measure or indeed a cure?

Canada's Health Minister says that Canadians must now have a booster every nine months - and that there's no such thing as "fully vaccinated" any more. From ZeroHedge;

Canadians will be required to get a Covid shot every nine months for the foreseeable future, says Health Minister Jean-Yves Duclos. Previous definitions of “fully vaccinated” made no sense, he told reporters.

“Nine months is very clear and will help people understand why ‘up to date’ is the right way to think about vaccination now,” said Duclos.

“‘Fully vaccinated’ makes no sense now. It’s about ‘up to date.’  So am I up to date in my vaccination? Have I received a vaccination in the last nine months?”

Duclos previously called for the provinces to make vaccinations mandatory and when asked by reporters if mandates would return this fall, he replied “We must continue to fight against Covid.”

I would never have picked Canada as the place that would go the hardest on mandates and coming down hard on political dissent - but there you go.

A judge in Uruguay has ordered Pfizer to release a full list of their 11 secret herbs and spices in their COVID19 vaccine - and Pfizer are so unhappy about it that they're going to leave the country. MercoPress;

An Uruguayan court has ruled that the national government and the laboratory Pfizer must disclose during a hearing this coming Wednesday the exact components of the COVID-19 vaccine of that brand which is widely used throughout the country.

The Uruguayan government and the pharmaceutical were given 48 hours by Judge Alejandro Recarey to submit detailed information on the anticovid vaccines while dealing with an injunction request to halt vaccination among children aged 5 and over which is nevertheless carried out voluntarily.

As per the court's decision, the Executive and the U.S. laboratory will have to provide documentation on the composition of the vaccines, including the possible presence of “graphene oxide” or “nanotechnological elements,” it was reported.

Also requested are data demonstrating the “innocuousness” of “the substance called messenger RNA” and that “the experimental nature” of the vaccines be accredited.

The judge also demanded explanations as to whether studies have been carried out “to explain the notorious increase in deaths due to covid-19 as of March 2021 in relation to the previous year.”

Pfizer will also have to address the issue “of adverse effects of the vaccines against the so-called Covid-19. In general, and also in detail in relation to the child population,” according to the court document.

Representatives of the Uruguayan Presidency and the Health Ministry as well as from the US pharmaceutical company are to appear at Wednesday's hearing.

The Uruguayan Ministry of Public Health, the State Health Services Administration, and the Presidency have also been required to submit all the information regarding the contract for the purchase of vaccines, where the clauses of civil indemnity or criminal impunity of the suppliers in the event of adverse effects are to be examined.

I mean, who can blame Pfizer? Coke won't tell us what's in Coke. So why should Pfizer tell us what's in their proprietary miracle COVID19 vaccine?

Is a masculine ego simply a preventative measure or indeed a cure?

If you have a healthy one, it’s a good defence against irrational panic and blind obedience. It also creates a strong desire to be right and therefore drives the need to find out about things and draw conclusions based on evidence rather than emotion.

For example, a healthy masculine ego is a good bulwark against internalised misandry.

There are calls for some more Coronavirus payments to be handed out as another wave of the Omicron Variant begins to take hold. the hospitals again are filling up with Covid patients and the ICU Wards, NSW Health has dramatically cut back their time for reinfection from 12 weeks to 28 days, 28 days!!, I'm unsure about the payments, maybe they should do them again in some form, it may help those that are "the battlers".

"28 days later"

LOLZ - people who put their faith into rubbish vaccines are rewarded with COVID19 - ABC;

Health officials are tackling a COVID outbreak that has seen more than 100 people infected on the Coral Princess, which is docked on the NSW South Coast.

There are 118 confirmed cases, including 114 crew and four passengers who have tested positive to the virus, Queensland’s Chief Health Officer (CHO) confirmed on Tuesday afternoon.

There were more than 2,300 guests and crew on the cruise ship that had sailed from Port Douglas in Far North Queensland to Brisbane.

Queensland CHO Dr John Gerrard said 24 people with COVID-19 disembarked in Brisbane and all were isolating and relatively well.

Dr Gerrard said it was “inevitable” that there would be outbreaks on cruise ships.

“To keep this virus off these ships where there are thousands of people in the middle of a pandemic is extraordinarily difficult," he said.

It's not "in the middle of a pandemic" - it's long after the pretend "pandemic" ended. But people are still getting the virus because they trusted the rubbish vaccines to protect them from the bat sniffles - it's not designed to do that. It was never designed to do that.

It's just rubbish like all the other consumerist crap that we're sold in the twenty-first century.

LOLZ - people who put their faith into rubbish vaccines are rewarded with COVID19 - ABC;

Health officials are tackling a COVID outbreak that has seen more than 100 people infected on the Coral Princess, which is docked on the NSW South Coast.

There are 118 confirmed cases, including 114 crew and four passengers who have tested positive to the virus, Queensland’s Chief Health Officer (CHO) confirmed on Tuesday afternoon.

There were more than 2,300 guests and crew on the cruise ship that had sailed from Port Douglas in Far North Queensland to Brisbane.

Queensland CHO Dr John Gerrard said 24 people with COVID-19 disembarked in Brisbane and all were isolating and relatively well.

Dr Gerrard said it was “inevitable” that there would be outbreaks on cruise ships.

“To keep this virus off these ships where there are thousands of people in the middle of a pandemic is extraordinarily difficult," he said.

It's not "in the middle of a pandemic" - it's long after the pretend "pandemic" ended. But people are still getting the virus because they trusted the rubbish vaccines to protect them from the bat sniffles - it's not designed to do that. It was never designed to do that.

It's just rubbish like all the other consumerist crap that we're sold in the twenty-first century.

It's not a "pretend pandemic" at all, of course the vaccines won't protect you from getting it, what they were designed to do was protect you from serious illness when you do get it., we are still in the COVID19 Pandemic, it has not ended yet.

It's not a "pretend pandemic" at all, of course the vaccines won't protect you from getting it, what they were designed to do was protect you from serious illness when you do get it., we are still in the COVID19 Pandemic, it has not ended yet.

What pandemic? Where?

Apart from incubating on floating petri-dishes known as cruise ships, it's just hovering around like influenza, colds and other endemic illnesses now and everyone has got used to it. Or if they haven't then they should - because it's not going anywhere.

The fact that they thought that everyone on a cruise ship being "fully vaccinated" would make everything hunky-dory goes to show just how stupid this belief in the pretend vaccines actually is. They don't prevent transmission, they don't stop you from getting sick - in close proximity to others for days at a time like you are on a cruise ship you'll almost certainly get it and get sick from it so it's really useless insisting that everyone should be vaccinated against it because it actually doesn't make a fig of difference.

And I'm sick to death of the excuse being used by state governments around the country that COVID is putting strain on the public hospital system. UNDER-FUNDING is what's doing that - not COVID. Malinauskus was elected here in South Australia on the promise of fixing the problems and they've done nothing (not that I'm surprised). State governments can't deliver basic services is the problem and they're trying to blame it on the public.

Sydney and Melbourne could be facing the biggest health risk ever with cases skyrocketing in flu and covid. Governments had 2 years to prepare for this what has gone wrong ?

Today the Chief Health Officer, Paul Kelly came out and strongly recommended face masks be worn in public places such as Supermarkets etc etc..., this is in response to the very highly transmissible BA.5 Covid strain, I wear my face mask anyway, regardless of the situation.

Today the Chief Health Officer, Paul Kelly came out and strongly recommended face masks be worn in public places such as Supermarkets etc etc..., this is in response to the very highly transmissible BA.5 Covid strain, I wear my face mask anyway, regardless of the situation.

It’s now a habit when shopping. Keys, wallet and face mask.

Bring on the derogatory comments.

Today the Chief Health Officer, Paul Kelly came out and strongly recommended face masks be worn in public places such as Supermarkets etc etc..., this is in response to the very highly transmissible BA.5 Covid strain, I wear my face mask anyway, regardless of the situation.

It’s now a habit when shopping. Keys, wallet and face mask.

Bring on the derogatory comments.

No derogatory comments from me. I agree with you. There has been much controversy surrounding face masks but I happen to know situations where people wore them and did not get infected, in the same workplace, in the same car, in the same household. They are a pain to carry around, to remember to wear, and change, but they are a simple measure and they work (most of the time). It sure beats having 3 weeks of an avoidable illness.

Today the Chief Health Officer, Paul Kelly came out and strongly recommended face masks be worn in public places such as Supermarkets etc etc..., this is in response to the very highly transmissible BA.5 Covid strain, I wear my face mask anyway, regardless of the situation.

It’s now a habit when shopping. Keys, wallet and face mask.

Bring on the derogatory comments.

Nah, I really don't care about people in face masks, that's entirely your choice. I just don't believe in their ability to do anything is all - but I certainly wouldn't deride anyone else for wearing them, particularly in flu season on public transport.

Today the Chief Health Officer, Paul Kelly came out and strongly recommended face masks be worn in public places such as Supermarkets etc etc..., this is in response to the very highly transmissible BA.5 Covid strain, I wear my face mask anyway, regardless of the situation.

It’s now a habit when shopping. Keys, wallet and face mask.

Bring on the derogatory comments.

Nah, I really don't care about people in face masks, that's entirely your choice. I just don't believe in their ability to do anything is all - but I certainly wouldn't deride anyone else for wearing them, particularly in flu season on public transport.

I certainly don’t care one iota. Had a few verbal stoushes with individuals, favourite.
You realise you don’t have to wear that.
Yes, but it assists me in minding my own frigging business.

Today the Chief Health Officer, Paul Kelly came out and strongly recommended face masks be worn in public places such as Supermarkets etc etc..., this is in response to the very highly transmissible BA.5 Covid strain, I wear my face mask anyway, regardless of the situation.

It’s now a habit when shopping. Keys, wallet and face mask.

Bring on the derogatory comments.

Nah, I really don't care about people in face masks, that's entirely your choice. I just don't believe in their ability to do anything is all - but I certainly wouldn't deride anyone else for wearing them, particularly in flu season on public transport.

I certainly don’t care one iota. Had a few verbal stoushes with individuals, favourite.
You realise you don’t have to wear that.
Yes, but it assists me in minding my own frigging business.

Look, Asian people in this country have been wearing masks on buses/trains for years, especially in the winter.

Why would I care? Seriously. Feel free to breathe your own filth, I don't care.

Just having a look, the Daily Mail has published an article on the fact that Facemasks don't make one bit of difference, they have obtained data from Singapore and NZ, I was always of the belief that Masks were 53% LESS likely for a person to catch Covid, flu, whatever, I guess that will always be a sticking point.

Today the Chief Health Officer, Paul Kelly came out and strongly recommended face masks be worn in public places such as Supermarkets etc etc..., this is in response to the very highly transmissible BA.5 Covid strain, I wear my face mask anyway, regardless of the situation.

It’s now a habit when shopping. Keys, wallet and face mask.

Bring on the derogatory comments.

Nah, I really don't care about people in face masks, that's entirely your choice. I just don't believe in their ability to do anything is all - but I certainly wouldn't deride anyone else for wearing them, particularly in flu season on public transport.

I certainly don’t care one iota. Had a few verbal stoushes with individuals, favourite.
You realise you don’t have to wear that.
Yes, but it assists me in minding my own frigging business.

Look, Asian people in this country have been wearing masks on buses/trains for years, especially in the winter.

Why would I care? Seriously. Feel free to breathe your own filth, I don't care.

I’d prefer people breath their own filth than share with me.
What say you?