NEW TIMETABLE – TRAM ROUTE 19

 
  The Met Chief Commissioner

Location: 37.55-S /145.01-E
NEW TIMETABLE – TRAM ROUTE 19

http://www.metlinkmelbourne.com.au/latest_news/service_alteration_detail.php?id=1883

Yarra Trams wishes to advise passengers that from Sunday, 7 August 2005 a new timetable for services along tram Route 19 (North Coburg – City) will be trialled for a two-month period.

As part of the trial, Yarra Trams will be testing a new combined frequency and timetable information format at tram stops.

Yarra Trams welcomes your feedback.  Please call 1800 800 166 between 6am and 10pm daily.


Passengers can contact Metlink on 131 638 if they require any additional information.


Wah, a timetable that just says frequency?

Well YT [early days] released prototype timetables that was the size of a Metcards, folded out and just said the frequency's for that certain time. Works better in my opinion, no more getting that certain tram...

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  mjja Sir Nigel Gresley

Location: Mount Waverley, Melbourne
Good, that sounds much more useful than scanning down a long list of numbers and saying "Now let's see, if that one's running two minutes late I might catch it, otherwise I'll have to wait three minutes for that one". Much easier to just say "Services along here are every five minutes, so I'll just turn up because I know I'll get one within that time".
  The Met Chief Commissioner

Location: 37.55-S /145.01-E
Yes i agree, but then again, there's always gonna be ' a tram around that time, then you can always catch that B Class... instead of a Z... [of course that doesn't necassarily happen]
  Metlink Chief Commissioner

Location: Camberwell Station or on Tram 109 or bus 302
i dont see anything wrong with the trams along there, even at 10.30 at night they run all the time. i wish 109 was like that.lol
  tayser Deputy Commissioner

Location: Melbourne
bout bloody time, the less  we give people the chance to smeg and moan about EXACTLY when a tram / train / bus / whatever is late the better.

all anyone needs to know is how often a service will arrive and an approximate journey time to destinations - all of that can easily be incorporated into existing infrastructure now that the wasted space is no longer.

eg.
Mon-Fri mornings: 12"
Mon-Fri peaks: 8"
Mon-Fri days: 10"
Mon-Fri nights: 12"
Sat-Sun mornings: 15"
Sat-Sun days: 12"
Sat-Sun nights: 20"

xyz stop to
- City: 20 minutes
- abc street / intersection: 13 minutes

etc.
  Aussie Steve Deputy Commissioner

Can I ask if people know which side of the road is a clearway at what time of the day?
  Gwiwer Rt Hon Gentleman and Ghost of Oliver Bulleid

Location: Loitering in darkest Somewhere
Sydney Road is a clearway 7-9am inbound and 4-6pm outbound

The 19 is a good route to trial the new information on since it is the most frequent, being every 6 minutes basic headway and up to every 4 minutes in the peaks.

It's almost impossible to tell as a waiting passenger whether the tram you board at any given time is the one due, or is up to 5 minutes late.  Drivers sometimes cop abuse from passengers thinking they are a late runner when they are actually on time.  

I shall be interested to see how this works.
  The Met Chief Commissioner

Location: 37.55-S /145.01-E
i just wait for a tram untill it comes, don't really care if it's on time...
  Ben-P19 Chief Commissioner

Location: Greensborough, Vic
So what are the details of the new timetable? Neither the Yarra trams or Metlink Melbourne websites have any indication that there is a new timetable other than what is posted above.
  Gwiwer Rt Hon Gentleman and Ghost of Oliver Bulleid

Location: Loitering in darkest Somewhere

So what are the details of the new timetable

Metlink and YT cannot post the new timetable in advance on the main pages as these are linked to the current timetable.  They could perhaps have provided a link to a new page with the details.  I'm guessing there will be little difference except perhaps in running time as the PSR requirement means that frequencies, and first / last car times would be more or less unchanged.

And if this would result in any significant change to working patterns or loss of work you'd have heard something from the ladies and gentlemen of Brunswick depot by now.

As they say, it's a 2-month trial.  Let's give it a go and see what works.
  PaxInfo Deputy Commissioner

Location: Melbourne

all anyone needs to know is how often a service will arrive
"tayser"


Disagree, unless services are very frequent (eg 5 min) at all times.  

 National Bus tried it on Route 246 (where buses can be up to 40 min apart), it got into the local paper, then everyone realised it was a bad idea and agreed to go back to regular timetables.  

Sometimes people are better off walking than catching the tram to go distances up to 15 min walk away (approx 1.5 km).  A prime example is when transferring from Glenhuntly Railway Station to an eastbound Route 67 tram.  Actual times help the passenger make the decision when to walk and when to wait.  In contrast, frequency guides would be no help here.  

Other times people are going in the other direction and need to meet a train at a certain time.  Again frequency guides are no help and people may be better off walking.

Reducing certainty by not providing proper timetables makes PT appear even slower than cars and could undermine patronage.

Although it is slightly less comprehensible than what we have now, the following format however might be acceptable as it shows exact times for all services.

5:00am
5:20
5:40
then every 20 minutes until 6:50am
7:00
7:10
7:20
then every 10 minutes until 8:50am
9:02
9:14
9:26
9:38
9:50
then every 12 minutes until X pm

etc

and an approximate journey time to destinations
"tayser"


This would be a welcome addition.  

Rgds, Peter
  Karl Junior Train Controller

Location: Collingwood
Sometimes people are better off walking than catching the tram to go distances up to 15 min walk away (approx 1.5 km).... Actual times help the passenger make the decision when to walk and when to wait.  In contrast, frequency guides would be no help here.

and an approximate journey time to destinations
"tayser"


This would be a welcome addition.

Rgds, Peter
"Meltrip"


Agree fully on both points. On the first issue in particular, I have on several occasions on weekday evenings (8-9pm-ish) walked not just 15 minutes but a full half an hour or more, from Queen Street to Fitzroy, without a single 112 passing me by.

Not that I mind generally but if like today it's wet and freezing, I would like to know rather more precisely when the next tram is coming so I can make an informed decision.

Most passengers accept (and probably expect) some minor variance from the timetable, especially with trams which are in most areas at the mercy of traffic, lights etc. But at the risk of stating the obvious, the most important thing to passengers is not so much what is happening but being informed of what is happening, being kept updated if there are delays, diversions etc.

A full timetable should be the first level of service information complemented at the next level with real-time information. YT increasingly has no reason not to be able to provide both as it expands the PID network, combined with Tram Attendants at key stops during the day. I appreciate this won't be the case everywhere at present but in time I think this is the way to go. Perhaps an SMS information service could be developed for areas where lower demand makes the PIDs less cost-effective?
  Gwiwer Rt Hon Gentleman and Ghost of Oliver Bulleid

Location: Loitering in darkest Somewhere
A "Timetable" should be a display of departure times from the boarding point with either arrival times at key stops down the line or (at the least) an indication of journey time.

It is of no use to me to arrive at an unfamiliar stop to be greeted with the all too common "Deaprture list" which in Australia is what is usually passed off as a "Timetable".  Yes it tells me that the next bus / tram / train leaves in 13 minutes but there is no indication of how long it might take to reach its destination, or any given point along the route.

I need to have some idea of whether a proposed journey is likely to take me 10 / 30 / 60 minutes, particualrly if I am in a city or suburb I am not familiar with, and / or if I have time-critical onward connections or appointments.

Connex has it right.  YT has the minimum acceptable at some stops and is below this at others, as they have only recently put journey times onto some departure lists - and not terribly easy to understand timings at that - while bus operators (with some exceptions who use the printed timetable leaflet as the display poster) generally are poor and show no idea of what the public requires, nor of the needs of that future revenue source, the prospective passenger seeking information.

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