Last train to use the burra line beyond roseworthy

 
  Gayspie Assistant Commissioner

Location: Adelaide, SA
i was wondering when was the last train on the burra line beyond roseworthy to burra, balaklava, farrel flat, kapunda and when was the last train on that line past the gawler river bridge? why does not genesse and wyoming operate a grain service out there today?

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  David Peters Dr Beeching

Location: "With Hey Boy".
The last train was a John McAveney tour I think to Burra or beyond it ran specially as the last train.

And the answer as to why G&W do not run trains there is simple it would not pay, what out that way today could really be transported by BG rail only grain and the farmers now take their grain to another super grain loading station where it can all be shipped out in bulk trains rather than in dribs and drabs almost as in the past. The grain would only go one way as well what are you going to cart in. Fertiliser is not the answer here as it is now made specially for each paddock almost so it cannot be shipped in bulk. Other than that there is nothing. No freight, no payment, so no movement!
  AFULE Chief Train Controller

Location: South Australia
i was wondering when was the last train on the burra line beyond roseworthy to burra, balaklava, farrel flat, kapunda and when was the last train on that line past the gawler river bridge. why does not genesse and wyoming operate a grain service out there today
"Heath Loxton"




Can't remember when the last grain train operated on the line but it would have to be probably about 8 years ago, maybe more.

GWA would love to run trains on the Burra line, but the only freight is grain and the grain industry/farmers only want to use road truck operators who work will always under cut the rail freight rate, they will do it for a tank of fuel.

The trucking industry killed of regional rail in SA and a lot of those truck operators are farmers, so don't blame GWA and the other operators for the loss of grain to road. 
  ANDL36Y Train Controller

If the line was maintained by the State Govt. or by the ARTC for example, I wonder if GWA would be still transporting grain by rail...?

Cheers,
Joshua
  AFULE Chief Train Controller

Location: South Australia
If the line was maintained by the State Govt. or by the ARTC for example, I wonder if GWA would be still transporting grain by rail...?

Cheers,
Joshua
"ANDL36Y"


It has nothing to do with who owned the line, look at the Peebinga, Yinkanie, Waikerie and Barmera lines, they were owned by the Australian Government and still closed as has many others throughout Australia. it's call economics whether we like it or not.



  justapassenger Chief Commissioner

There is also a chicken/egg situation with grain haulage, so long as Viterra refuse to use rail then GWA will be able to claim they don't need to run services, which in turn will give Viterra a good excuse to use trucks, which in turn ...


This situation caused by the Viterra/GWA Mexican stand-off has in turn caused many farmers to purchase their own trucks so they can go direct to the larger loading sites rather than just the local silo.
  AFULE Chief Train Controller

Location: South Australia
There is also a chicken/egg situation with grain haulage, so long as Viterra refuse to use rail then GWA will be able to claim they don't need to run services, which in turn will give Viterra a good excuse to use trucks, which in turn ...


This situation caused by the Viterra/GWA Mexican stand-off has in turn caused many farmers to purchase their own trucks so they can go direct to the larger loading sites rather than just the local silo.
"justapassenger"


This grain fiasco started well before GWA, ask any of the former AN grain managers and they will tell you that, SACBH which owned the silo's and had farmers as share holders started this, the then Liberal Government at the time assisted by letting B-Double trucks on to the roads and then Road -Trains.



  zacker Station Master

The line past Saddleworth to Burra has absolute zitch chance of reopening. All the grain storage facilities along this line are small and not equipped for fast-rail loading. I believe that some grain trains ran to Saddleworth in the early 2000's but none for a very long time. Broad gauge trains ceased running to Roseworthy in about 2006 if memory serves me correct. At this time the Outer Harbour grain terminal was in advanced planning stage and the balloon loop at the terminal was designed to be that of standard gauge only. This effectively killed any chance of grain being hauled on the mid north rail lines as trains would only be able to discharge at Port Adelaide terminal (dual gauge).

So unfortunately, unless the rail lines are to be standardised (GWA operate 130 odd standard gauge grain hoppers), there will be no grain traffic on the mid north. Even if the lines are standardised, unless the trans adelaide network has about 7 km's of dual gauge line laid from Gawler, standard gauge trains will not even be able to access this line.

None of this will ever happen unless a big mine or something of the sort is operating in the area around the current rail line.

Maybe some genius can design a dual gauge wagon for standard and broad gauge? Don't know how something like this would work though! If something like this was done then potentially grain could be hauled from as far as Ouyen to Adelaide through the Pinnaroo standard gauge line as well as potentially be able to go to the Saddleworth grain loading facilities. I don't know how the locomotive situation would go though as you would need to swap loco's at the change of gauge.

Out of interests sake does anybody know the maximum axle load allowable on the mid north lines and the max speed when trains were last running? I know for example that on the Pinnaroo and Loxton lines, they allow 19t axle loads so about 50-52t of grain could be loaded into a wagon.
  AFULE Chief Train Controller

Location: South Australia
The line past Saddleworth to Burra has absolute zitch chance of reopening. All the grain storage facilities along this line are small and not equipped for fast-rail loading. I believe that some grain trains ran to Saddleworth in the early 2000's but none for a very long time. Broad gauge trains ceased running to Roseworthy in about 2006 if memory serves me correct. At this time the Outer Harbour grain terminal was in advanced planning stage and the balloon loop at the terminal was designed to be that of standard gauge only. This effectively killed any chance of grain being hauled on the mid north rail lines as trains would only be able to discharge at Port Adelaide terminal (dual gauge).

So unfortunately, unless the rail lines are to be standardised (GWA operate 130 odd standard gauge grain hoppers), there will be no grain traffic on the mid north. Even if the lines are standardised, unless the trans adelaide network has about 7 km's of dual gauge line laid from Gawler, standard gauge trains will not even be able to access this line.

None of this will ever happen unless a big mine or something of the sort is operating in the area around the current rail line.

Maybe some genius can design a dual gauge wagon for standard and broad gauge? Don't know how something like this would work though! If something like this was done then potentially grain could be hauled from as far as Ouyen to Adelaide through the Pinnaroo standard gauge line as well as potentially be able to go to the Saddleworth grain loading facilities. I don't know how the locomotive situation would go though as you would need to swap loco's at the change of gauge.

Out of interests sake does anybody know the maximum axle load allowable on the mid north lines and the max speed when trains were last running? I know for example that on the Pinnaroo and Loxton lines, they allow 19t axle loads so about 50-52t of grain could be loaded into a wagon.
"zacker"


I like your factual response, originally the new Outer Harbor grain facility was going to be dual gauge but SACBH/Ausbulk in there wisdom decided to cost save and have standard gauge only, I have been told that those decision makers are no longer working in the grain industry, once again it is to late to undo the blunder made..

Last time I looked it was 19t axle load.
  AN830 Locomotive Driver

Location: Adelaide, South Australia
The last train to Saddleworth ran in August/September 2005. 

Roseworthy trains cease in early 2008 i believe and the last light engine to movement to Burra was in 2004.

As for the Kapunda line I am unsure when the last movement was on that line.

Cheers


  ANDL36Y Train Controller

If the line was maintained by the State Govt. or by the ARTC for example, I wonder if GWA would be still transporting grain by rail...?

Cheers,
Joshua
"ANDL36Y"


It has nothing to do with who owned the line, look at the Peebinga, Yinkanie, Waikerie and Barmera lines, they were owned by the Australian Government and still closed as has many others throughout Australia. it's call economics whether we like it or not.
"AFULE"


It was a hypothetical premise - if GWA didn't have to maintain the 'below rail' stuff as well - which was my point.

Cheers,
Joshua
  monday Chief Commissioner

The broad gauge grain network doesnt stack up financially.

- The silo situation, as noted above. 

- I would hazard a guess that the cost per tonne delivered is significantly higher than what can be done by road from those small facilities.

- The infrastructure management costs, above and below rail.

The industy is definitely heading towards those high discharge facilities and larger hoppers.  Not small, little engines with little hoppers carrying a relatively low % payload.

In any case, besides the grain situation at Outer Harbour, all the AHDL's have been cut up (or most of anyway), so there isnt a broad gauge fleet to speak of anyway.

Youll probably find a good deal of grain is still moved by rail, aside from Roseworthy, but just it moves via the SG network rather than lots of little silos along the way.



  Top Cat Assistant Commissioner

Location: Under Hilton Bridge
I cant give you exact dates (at present) but I can confirm that the last loaded grain train from Roseworthy left in late February 2007.  The sidings were used to store grain hoppers until they were removed in October 2007. 8)
  alcoworldseries Deputy Commissioner

Location: Auburn
I believe I worked the last train to/from Kapunda in 1999, although there was several light engine movements after this date to maintain "right of way", last one I know of was CK4 about 2002.
I note no -one has mentioned the extensive wash aways around Stockport that will, without major capital expenditure prevent any trains past Hamley Bridge, I also believe that the bridge(s) at Hamley are also out of survey, so another big cost to restart.
  Gayspie Assistant Commissioner

Location: Adelaide, SA
when was the last train to balaklava? why would GWA run right of way trains to kapunda 3 years after closure? and could i please have a summary of the mid north line closure dates?  Very Happy
  alcoworldseries Deputy Commissioner

Location: Auburn
They also ran similar services on other closed lines for a similar length of time, no doubt because of some obscure clause in the lease of the lines agreement, suggest last train to Balaklava ran about same time as last train to Saddleworth as mentioned previously.

when was the last train to balaklava and why would GWA run right of way trains to kapunda 3 years after closure and could i please have a summary of the mid north line closure dates Very Happy
"Heath Loxton"
  Nightfire Minister for Railways

Location: Gippsland
I guess one could expect South Australia's rail trail network, will expand along these disused rail corridors !
  AN830 Locomotive Driver

Location: Adelaide, South Australia
The last train to Balaklava ran if IIRC in 2004.

As for more rail trails along disused corridors, that could be a real possibility in the future.
  alcoworldseries Deputy Commissioner

Location: Auburn
Remains to be seen if GWA, as the lessor, excersises their right to  remove their assets from the lease prior to surrendering lease back to DPTI, which will need to occur before any rail trail can start. If assets removed there is going to be some very busy scrap merchants. Can any one highlight which structures if any are heritage listed (or should be listed)?
  james.au Chief Commissioner

Location: Sydney, NSW
Sorry to open up an old thread and blow dust everywhere, but what sort of grain volumes come out of the corridor from Roseworthy to Peterborough??
  bingley hall Minister for Railways

Location: Last train to Skaville
Sorry to open up an old thread and blow dust everywhere, but what sort of grain volumes come out of the corridor from Roseworthy to Peterborough??
james.au
It used to be easy to access that kind of info which was publicly available, but now the silo network is owned by a private company they do not have to provide that info. Plus fragmentation of the grains industry in recent years means that not all grain passes through the local silo system.

Last I heard, which was some time back, Roseworthy had a capacity of around 300,000t - a lot of stuff previoulsy destined to the smaller silos would head directly there now.
  Pressman Spirit of the Vine

Location: Wherever the Tin Chook or Qantas takes me
Sorry to open up an old thread and blow dust everywhere, but what sort of grain volumes come out of the corridor from Roseworthy to Peterborough??
It used to be easy to access that kind of info which was publicly available, but now the silo network is owned by a private company they do not have to provide that info. Plus fragmentation of the grains industry in recent years means that not all grain passes through the local silo system.

Last I heard, which was some time back, Roseworthy had a capacity of around 300,000t - a lot of stuff previoulsy destined to the smaller silos would head directly there now.
bingley hall
There aren't any silo locations north of Burra (Track was lifted between Burra and Peterborough soon after the SG line to Adelaide was opened as the BG line became a "grain only" line to Burra)
I think all the silo locations, except Roseworthy*, that remain 'open' are now classed as Tier2 sites.

{Tier 2 sites attract a higher service charge per tonne to the grain grower than Tier1 (approx. 6% higher)
*Roseworthy is a Tier 1 site}
  bingley hall Minister for Railways

Location: Last train to Skaville
There aren't any silo locations north of Burra (Track was lifted between Burra and Peterborough soon after the SG line to Adelaide was opened as the BG line became a "grain only" line to Burra)
I think all the silo locations, except Roseworthy*, that remain 'open' are now classed as Tier2 sites.

{Tier 2 sites attract a higher service charge per tonne to the grain grower than Tier1 (approx. 6% higher)
*Roseworthy is a Tier 1 site}

Pressman
For a few years after the through route was closed trains still served the silos at Hallett. I don't know if the Hallett silos still receive grain?
  Pressman Spirit of the Vine

Location: Wherever the Tin Chook or Qantas takes me
There aren't any silo locations north of Burra (Track was lifted between Burra and Peterborough soon after the SG line to Adelaide was opened as the BG line became a "grain only" line to Burra)
I think all the silo locations, except Roseworthy*, that remain 'open' are now classed as Tier2 sites.

{Tier 2 sites attract a higher service charge per tonne to the grain grower than Tier1 (approx. 6% higher)
*Roseworthy is a Tier 1 site}

For a few years after the through route was closed trains still served the silos at Hallett. I don't know if the Hallett silos still receive grain?
bingley hall
Hallett is not currently listed on Viterra's web site as open

I'd forgotten that Hallett was north of Burra.
I do remember that I replaced the Elevator Motor Starter panel there in the late 1970's. It was a special because the site didn't have 3 phase power, it was rural single phase power only. The silo was(is) a two cell concrete block only.
(there were three other twin cell blocks with similar single phase power supplies, 2 at Andrews, and 1 at Melrose)
  Nightfire Minister for Railways

Location: Gippsland


Hallett is not currently listed on Viterra's web site as open

I'd forgotten that Hallett was north of Burra.
I do remember that I replaced the Elevator Motor Starter panel there in the late 1970's. It was a special because the site didn't have 3 phase power, it was rural single phase power only. The silo was(is) a two cell concrete block only.
(there were three other twin cell blocks with similar single phase power supplies, 2 at Andrews, and 1 at Melrose)
Pressman
Was It doubled up single phase 480 volts ?

Since 2000 the Australian power grid has been altered to 230 volt single phase and 400 volt 3 phase @ 50 hz, Inline with most of Europe.

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