Malcolm Turncoat's imploding act

 
  Carnot Minister for Railways

NEG! Is a lemon. What does it mean to Billy Bloggs? SFA.

AGL and other suppliers would be satisfied to see heavy industries/users go offshore, as they are then free to drive remaining coal fired power generating assets into the ground and charge mega bucks to the domestic user for the privilege.  And be heavily subsidised to supply green/renewable to same.

Edit. Drove past the old power house at Wallerwang, over the weekend. The water cooling faciilities have been removed. No chance of that site producing power again.
michaelgm
Mr Bloggs scratches his head and goes "huh?".

I've tried to get my head around it - without much success.  It seems to have noble aims - reduce emissions, more reliable supply, stable or lower prices.  And then you have some saying it'll kill investment in renewables, others saying it is too aggressive in reducing emissions, and also quite a few saying it won't reduce costs or improve reliability.  I suppose it depends on one's ideology and economic outlook.

My gut-feeling:  Propping up old coal-fired power stations will add to power bills.  Gas will still get offloaded cheaply to overseas while we get ripped off.  And a drying up of investment in renewables will cause a shortage of power and reduce reliability.  Basically the opposite of the NEG's aims.

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  don_dunstan Dr Beeching

Location: Adelaide proud
Wasn't Menzies called Pig Iron Bob because he sold our scrap steel to the Japanese. After his failure to prosecute WW2 in Australia's favor, I never understood why he was voted in after WW2.
nswtrains
Chifley's plan after the war was too radical and involved nationalising the banks - the Liberal Party capitalised on the fear that Labor was lurching too far into socialism and won office in 1949. It's true that Menzies was a terrible war-time leader and spent half the war stuck in the UK anyway; he didn't anticipate the rise of the Japanese into an aggressive military power and used troops to break the union blockade of scrap metal headed for Japan only months before the outbreak of war with Germany. IN peacetime he was much more savvy and ran rings around the Labor party for a decade and a half - Labor at that time also had tremendous internal difficulties to do with Catholicism and the communist threat.
  Valvegear Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Richmond Vic
Wasn't Menzies called Pig Iron Bob because he sold our scrap steel to the Japanese. After his failure to prosecute WW2 in Australia's favor, I never understood why he was voted in after WW2.
"nswtrains"
Promising to abolish rationing didn't do his cause any harm.
  don_dunstan Dr Beeching

Location: Adelaide proud
Maybe if the western world had not screwed over China in the past the Mao Revolution would not have occurred. Whilst I do not agree with the worst aspects of the Cultural Revolution, these events did not just spring out of thin air but were the natural result of such horrible events as the Boxer Rebellion and the Opium wars. Don't forget the suffering the Chinese people endured under the Japanese occupation. They have not had a good run in the overall picture of world events.
nswtrains
That's a valid point, the West has interfered with China for quite some time but I'm not sure Mao's actions after the revolution can be entirely attributed to the various occupations.

Incidentally only two people actually died in the Boxer Rebellion, it was a total failure by the Qing court and ultimately led to the Nationalist overthrow of the monarchs 11 years later; and opium was already a problem in China before the British East India Company started bringing it in. The Chinese people comprise of a lot of ethnic minorities and the Han themselves were divided into ruling kingdoms with their various dynasties. Like Germany it didn't really unite as a single nation until the various incursions by other countries forced them to combine under one monarchy/dynasty.

The China you see now was really Deng's creation - they could have very well gone the other way post-Mao and ended up a massive North Korea.
  Carnot Minister for Railways

It'll be interesting to hear how Turnbull responds to Sen. Fraser Anning's ethno-nationalistic rant in parliament today praising the White Australia Policy and wanting a ban on Muslim immigration.  Probably the most inflammatory speech since Pauline Hanson in 1996:
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-08-14/fraser-anning-maiden-speech-immigration-solution/10120270

Stupid choice of words and counter-productive IMO.
  Groundrelay Chief Commissioner

Location: Surrounded by Trolls!
So is Truffles going to lead the Coalition of the cliff like lemmings?? , because if the polls continue like they are, you will have Bill Shorten as PM, it is quite clear that no one likes Truffles, because he has tried everything, and the public ain't listening, so what next for Truffles??

Kind Regards
They're set to roll him tomorrow at the party room over the useless NEG. It's all a smokescreen for the fact that they won't take on the gas cartel - in fact modelling suggests that power prices will double under the NEG anyway, so what's the point?
don_dunstan
Sounds like you're both rusted onto cash-for-comment radio. Every commentator I heard said that Abbott only had a handful of supporters at best and the NEG would go through, as indeed it did.

Turnbull's popularity is still streets ahead of Abbott the darling of that radio station. The fact that they give him so much coverage counts for very little in the broader community. Way too much oxygen is given to this back bencher and it's not exactly helping the Libs either.

Yes the NEG is a waste of time in so far as that $550pa saving just like dumping Carbon Pricing.
  Showtime Chief Train Controller

Please explain to me why we have spend/waste millions/billions on renewable technology?
Wind farms have been in use in Europe for years, Hydro has been in use in Europe and the USA for decades, Tesla has invented "the battery", and the Chinese have perfected solar cells.
Why are we trying to re-invent the wheel?
The research and development has already been done all over the world so if we have to have renewables why do we have to subsidise them at the expense of cheaper and more reliable coal fired stations?
The whole crock just smells bad to me.
If the subsidies were removed on renewables tomorrow, then AGL would have to backflip on closing what would then be cheaper coal fired power stations. It's all about profits, not emissions.
And would we be in this position if the NSW Government had not sold off all the power stations to private companies in the first place. Premiers like Baird and Gladys have a lot to answer for over the situation we are now in.
The NEG is a farce and Turnbull has forever shown that he is green inside with an empty scrotum on the outside.
  don_dunstan Dr Beeching

Location: Adelaide proud
Sounds like you're both rusted onto cash-for-comment radio. Every commentator I heard said that Abbott only had a handful of supporters at best and the NEG would go through, as indeed it did.

Turnbull's popularity is still streets ahead of Abbott the darling of that radio station. The fact that they give him so much coverage counts for very little in the broader community. Way too much oxygen is given to this back bencher and it's not exactly helping the Libs either.

Yes the NEG is a waste of time in so far as that $550pa saving just like dumping Carbon Pricing.
Groundrelay
Yeah well maybe I'm channelling Alan Jones sometimes... who knows.

Abbott is making a comeback both with the public and his own party - they didn't manage to roll this bullsh*t NEG in the Party Room but it probably won't make it through the Senate so it's all a moot point anyway. Pauline Hanson again talking sense on this when she points out that Paris is the worst possible deal for Australia and nobody else is complying so why are we? Again, the much-derided Fish & Chip Shop Lady is seemingly one of the only people in the whole bloody place who is speaking the truth. NEG has nothing at all to do with reducing the domestic cost of power, as Showtime said (above) it's got to do with providing a smoke-screen for Origin and AGL (et al) to continue plundering our country's natural resources while the government pretends everything is okay.

Abbott has also been positioning himself with making friends across the parliament; even out of former enemies. It's obvious there's a tilt coming, probably before the end of the year - I don't gamble on these things but it's interesting to watch what Sportsbet says on these things and Malcolm's chances of making it to the next election have lengthened recently. We'll see.

And frankly I'm also worried about Labor's fiscal responsibility in office - Julia Gillard spent like there was no tomorrow when she was in office and some of these things (VET-FEE-HELP, NDIS, NBN) have really been incredibly costly and seemingly un-costed at the start. Where does the money come from? It's bad enough that the Liberals have now put us on the hook for the most expensiv project in Australia's history - ever (new submarines) - I'm really worried that if Shorten coasts in he's set to try and build a skyhook or a space station or a bridge to Tassie or something and finally bankrupt the joint!
  lsrailfan Chief Commissioner

Location: Somewhere you're not
Just wondering if everyone caught the speech of Frazer Anning yesterday, it was incredible to see all the outpouring of emotion, although a tad hypocritical from some, (Hello Derryn Hinch), I mean fair dinkum, imagine if the pollies put as much energy into making our lives a lot better, as they did by condemning one man, is it any wonder why we have ratbags for pollies these days!  

Kind Regards
  YM-Mundrabilla Minister for Railways

Location: Mundrabilla but I'd rather be in Narvik
Just wondering if everyone caught the speech of Frazer Anning yesterday, it was incredible to see all the outpouring of emotion, although a tad hypocritical from some, (Hello Derryn Hinch), I mean fair dinkum, imagine if the pollies put as much energy into making our lives a lot better, as they did by condemning one man, is it any wonder why we have ratbags for pollies these days!  

Kind Regards
lsrailfan
Anything as a distraction from governing to improve the lives of the average Australian. Crying or Very sad

Imagine Royal Commissions into the Electricity and Gas Companies and the Oil Companies?

No we don't need these, the same way that we didn't need the Royal Commission into the Banks. Rolling Eyes
  don_dunstan Dr Beeching

Location: Adelaide proud
Just wondering if everyone caught the speech of Frazer Anning yesterday, it was incredible to see all the outpouring of emotion, although a tad hypocritical from some, (Hello Derryn Hinch), I mean fair dinkum, imagine if the pollies put as much energy into making our lives a lot better, as they did by condemning one man, is it any wonder why we have ratbags for pollies these days!  

Kind Regards
lsrailfan
The rat-bags are a product of the mainstream, look at Malcolm defending the interests of big business over the rest of us - they're hardly a shining example themselves and yet they expect us to vote for them.
  don_dunstan Dr Beeching

Location: Adelaide proud
Just wondering if everyone caught the speech of Frazer Anning yesterday, it was incredible to see all the outpouring of emotion, although a tad hypocritical from some, (Hello Derryn Hinch), I mean fair dinkum, imagine if the pollies put as much energy into making our lives a lot better, as they did by condemning one man, is it any wonder why we have ratbags for pollies these days!  

Kind Regards
Anything as a distraction from governing to improve the lives of the average Australian. Crying or Very sad

Imagine Royal Commissions into the Electricity and Gas Companies and the Oil Companies?

No we don't need these, the same way that we didn't need the Royal Commission into the Banks. Rolling Eyes
YM-Mundrabilla
The Australian is reporting today that Malcolm made assurances to skeptical MP's on Tuesday that the NEG would be coupled with an investigation into the monopoly pricing of electricity in Australia (but not gas). So far no announcement... I wonder if he just lied to them to get them to vote for it?
  don_dunstan Dr Beeching

Location: Adelaide proud
Yet again, it's up to the Fish & Chip shop lady from Ipswich to talk sense about tax (via the Financial Review):

Chances of the Turnbull government striking a compromise company tax deal have been dealt a blow, after One Nation leader Pauline Hanson demanded a crackdown on multinational gas companies first.

Senator Hanson told Sky News she was taking a “balanced view” and pointed out One Nation had already supported $179 billion in company and personal tax cuts.

But she remained concerned the tax cuts were un-affordable unless more was done to raise revenue from multinationals.

“To pass the other unlimited corporate tax cuts, that’s going to cost us another $45 billion which will not come in for eight years,” she said,

“That’s a total of $224 billion. Where is the money coming from? Dreadful policy"

Again, why it up to someone on the political margins to make the most sensible observations about the budget - the fact that we're hobbling future budgets by cutting taxes too much.
  Groundrelay Chief Commissioner

Location: Surrounded by Trolls!
Yeah well maybe I'm channelling Alan Jones...
don_dunstan
Well that's no surprise.

Abbott is making a comeback both with the public and his own party
don_dunstan
 Yep that confirms it Laughing

Despite what the cash-for-comment media have you believe it's more like
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-08-15/waning-influence-exposed-in-national-energy-guarantee-vote/10120532?section=politics

Even the Murdoch press has moved on.
  Groundrelay Chief Commissioner

Location: Surrounded by Trolls!
Yet again, it's up to the Fish & Chip shop lady from Ipswich to talk sense about tax...
don_dunstan
And all by herself too!

She can say anything and you're impressed. Bottom line is her voting record. Big tax cuts for the well off, penalty rate cuts for those who can least afford it.
  lsrailfan Chief Commissioner

Location: Somewhere you're not
Hearing that a possible challenge is on the cards for Truffles, Dutton will be the man to challenge in the coming weeks

Kind Regards
  Groundrelay Chief Commissioner

Location: Surrounded by Trolls!
Hearing that a possible challenge is on the cards for Truffles, Dutton will be the man to challenge in the coming weeks

Kind Regards
lsrailfan
In this morning's papers. There's even a thread here.
  don_dunstan Dr Beeching

Location: Adelaide proud
 Yep that confirms it Laughing

Despite what the cash-for-comment media have you believe it's more like
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-08-15/waning-influence-exposed-in-national-energy-guarantee-vote/10120532?section=politics

Even the Murdoch press has moved on.
Groundrelay
As I posted earlier today, Malcolm bullsh*tted to cabinet about having an electricity price enquiry to get them to vote for the NEG. What's the bet it turns out to be yet another Turnbull lie; he has no intention of exposing the gas and electricity rip-offs.
She can say anything and you're impressed.
Groundrelay
Find me someone else in parliament who is talking sense on tax revenues and the gas cartel.
Bottom line is her voting record. Big tax cuts for the well off, penalty rate cuts for those who can least afford it.
Groundrelay
Yeah, whatever. I'm still going to vote for her just to spite rubes like you.
  don_dunstan Dr Beeching

Location: Adelaide proud
Hearing that a possible challenge is on the cards for Truffles, Dutton will be the man to challenge in the coming weeks

Kind Regards
lsrailfan
Tones and Dutton are best buddies, it will be a victory for the conservative side. Abbott will probably get back into senior ministry.

All that Dutton needs to say is that he's going to cut immigration in half and they will win the next election - mark my words.
  lsrailfan Chief Commissioner

Location: Somewhere you're not
I see Tony Abbott is throwing more hand grenades into the mix - https://www.msn.com/en-au/news/australia/its-no-way-to-run-a-government-tony-abbott-slams-malcolm-turnbull-for-backflipping-on-plans-to-legislate-the-paris-emissions-reduction-target-fuelling-speculation-of-a-leadership-challenge-from-peter-dutton/ar-BBM4Maq?ocid=spartanntp- he says the Govt needs to ditch the NEG altogether, and called for a change of policy , well MR Abbott, for a change of policy to happen, you would have to dump Truffles, and send him back to eating Lobster Souffle! * I'm not saying Abbott should challenge, I am saying the Libs should challenge Turncoat, and install someone who can run the joint!

Kind Regards
  don_dunstan Dr Beeching

Location: Adelaide proud
Israilfan: It's incredibly sad when you find yourself agreeing with Tony Abbott - Malcolm is a spineless piece of jelly. He finally had an opportunity to do something about "climate change" which was an issue he'd been championing for over a decade - and he squibs it because he can't get his own party to vote for it. And how stupid to pass the proposed bill to the Labor Party before he gives it to the dissenters.

I think at this point we're probably better off with a Dutton led government, I dunno what advantage there is to the Australian people in electing Shorten apart from generous welfare programs for those people whose jobs have been off-shored. I could be wrong but a Labor/Greens coalition will not fix a single thing related to our long-term endemic and increasing poverty.
  don_dunstan Dr Beeching

Location: Adelaide proud
Whatever government we have after the next election there will still be the "Dairy" - (ABC);

Are consultants making so much money from the Federal Government that they're now treating departments as cash cows and openly dubbing it "The Dairy"?

That's the charge from federal Labor, which confronted the big four consultancy firms — Deloitte, KPMG, PriceWaterhouseCoopers and Ernst and Young — at a parliamentary inquiry on Friday.

The firms, which have won more than $1.7 billion in Federal Government business in recent years, say they are not aware of the nickname reportedly used by some Canberra-based staff who work with the Government.

The companies insist they are providing vital services and expertise, but former Border Force Commissioner Roman Quaedvlieg has described them as "a pack of predatory sharks hitting a bait ball in a feeding frenzy".

This sort of spending has exploded under the LNP and I'm guessing the Labor Party won't be any different despite their squealing.
  BrentonGolding Chief Commissioner

Location: Maldon Junction
Whatever government we have after the next election there will still be the "Dairy" - (ABC);
don_dunstan
Good find Don, I had missed that one. Interesting that they quote Roman Quaedvlieg who was sacked as Border Farce chief over corruption but fail to mention that in the article even though it would clearly be a factor potentially clouding his judgement and skewing his opinions.

BG
  don_dunstan Dr Beeching

Location: Adelaide proud
Whatever government we have after the next election there will still be the "Dairy" - (ABC);
Good find Don, I had missed that one. Interesting that they quote Roman Quaedvlieg who was sacked as Border Farce chief over corruption but fail to mention that in the article even though it would clearly be a factor potentially clouding his judgement and skewing his opinions.

BG
BrentonGolding
Maybe he wasn't tipping his hat to the consultancy firms?
  BrentonGolding Chief Commissioner

Location: Maldon Junction
Interesting that they quote Roman Quaedvlieg who was sacked as Border Farce chief over corruption but fail to mention that in the article even though it would clearly be a factor potentially clouding his judgement and skewing his opinions.

BG
Maybe he wasn't tipping his hat to the consultancy firms?
don_dunstan
He was doing a bit more than that.......

https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2018/mar/15/roman-quaedvlieg-sacked-as-head-of-border-force

BG

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