Severe weather and Bushfire thread 2019/20

 
  Groundrelay Chief Commissioner

Location: Surrounded by Trolls!
Sydney's air pollution today was terrible, with many bushfires burning in, and around the City, this pollution is expected to hang around for a few more days at least, there are over 100 fires burning in N.S.W, with many of these uncontained, of concern the most tonight, is a fire down south near Bateman's Bay, this has burnt well over 1,000 hectares, and is still at Emergency Warning level tonight.
lsrailfan
Might be nothing left to burn by the height of Summer. Bushfires may be cyclic but they never started in mid-Winter.

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  ANR Chief Commissioner

Confirming what we already know about fire ignition, but cannot publically discuss in the media due to copycats.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/science/2019-11-20/bushfire-ignition-source-how-we-know/11701132?pfmredir=ms

These fires will wipe out the East Coast if we don't get some rain soon.
  justapassenger Minister for Railways

Might be nothing left to burn by the height of Summer. Bushfires may be cyclic but they never started in mid-Winter.
Groundrelay
Fires do start in winter, it’s the summer conditions (which started early in spring this year) which allow them to spread beyond being just small grass fires.
  lsrailfan Chief Commissioner

Location: Somewhere you're not
Confirming what we already know about fire ignition, but cannot publically discuss in the media due to copycats.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/science/2019-11-20/bushfire-ignition-source-how-we-know/11701132?pfmredir=ms

These fires will wipe out the East Coast if we don't get some rain soon.
ANR
Might not be just the East Coast the way things are looking, it's bone dry in regional areas as well.
  wobert Chief Commissioner

Location: Half way between Propodolla and Kinimakatka
The pooh could be about to hit the fan,chickens are all lining up, to wit https://www.sbs.com.au/news/fears-for-drinking-water-as-ash-turns-sydney-s-beaches-black
  Graham4405 The Ghost of George Stephenson

Location: Dalby Qld
The pooh could be about to hit the fan,chickens are all lining up, to wit https://www.sbs.com.au/news/fears-for-drinking-water-as-ash-turns-sydney-s-beaches-black
wobert
Nambucca Heads beaches (and I suspect many others) were covered in ash weeks ago. That didn't make the headlines!
  ANR Chief Commissioner

Lake Burragorang's ash surrounds will send Cidney syders into panic mode. The water will surely be contaminated when the catchment gets their next downpour. How prepared are they? Even after boiling, the water will still stink. There will be panic at the supermarket as bottled water dries up.

Is the desal plant running? If so, will it provide the necessary capacity in the event that Burragorang water is no good? Why is Greater Cidney on level 2 water restrictions when they have desal?

Is someone in the bureaucracy asleep at the wheel? If they close their eyes it will go away...  Nothing too serious...
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
Lake Burragorang's ash surrounds will send Cidney syders into panic mode. The water will surely be contaminated when the catchment gets their next downpour. How prepared are they? Even after boiling, the water will still stink. There will be panic at the supermarket as bottled water dries up.

Is the desal plant running? If so, will it provide the necessary capacity in the event that Burragorang water is no good? Why is Greater Cidney on level 2 water restrictions when they have desal?

Is someone in the bureaucracy asleep at the wheel? If they close their eyes it will go away...  Nothing too serious...
ANR
The water is filtered, not the first time there has been heavy rain after a fire. As a former rain water tank owner with no filter you'd be surprised on how bad the water can get before you even notice.

Desal is running, but can only supply 10% of demand, in my view the trigger to turn it on was too late.
  Carnot Minister for Railways

Lake Burragorang's ash surrounds will send Cidney syders into panic mode. The water will surely be contaminated when the catchment gets their next downpour. How prepared are they? Even after boiling, the water will still stink. There will be panic at the supermarket as bottled water dries up.

Is the desal plant running? If so, will it provide the necessary capacity in the event that Burragorang water is no good? Why is Greater Cidney on level 2 water restrictions when they have desal?

Is someone in the bureaucracy asleep at the wheel? If they close their eyes it will go away...  Nothing too serious...
The water is filtered, not the first time there has been heavy rain after a fire. As a former rain water tank owner with no filter you'd be surprised on how bad the water can get before you even notice.

Desal is running, but can only supply 10% of demand, in my view the trigger to turn it on was too late.
RTT_Rules
Desal uses huge amounts of electricity, and the plant did need a big rebuild after it was smashed by a tornado a few years back.

Sydneysiders are just going to have to get used to foul tasting and smelling water for a while.

On the topic of Sydney and bushfires, they have had some bad ones over the years, such as November 1951: https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/45775788
  ANR Chief Commissioner

Lake Burragorang's ash surrounds will send Cidney syders into panic mode. The water will surely be contaminated when the catchment gets their next downpour. How prepared are they? Even after boiling, the water will still stink. There will be panic at the supermarket as bottled water dries up.

Is the desal plant running? If so, will it provide the necessary capacity in the event that Burragorang water is no good? Why is Greater Cidney on level 2 water restrictions when they have desal?

Is someone in the bureaucracy asleep at the wheel? If they close their eyes it will go away...  Nothing too serious...
The water is filtered, not the first time there has been heavy rain after a fire. As a former rain water tank owner with no filter you'd be surprised on how bad the water can get before you even notice.

Desal is running, but can only supply 10% of demand, in my view the trigger to turn it on was too late.
RTT_Rules
Filtered or not, I guarantee that no one would be able to put this stuff near their nose to drink it, even after boiling.
  Groundrelay Chief Commissioner

Location: Surrounded by Trolls!
Apparently the catchment needs a metre of rain. Like other drought affected areas, the ground is so dry they'd be very little runoff.
  Valvegear Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Norda Fittazroy
Sydneysiders are just going to have to get used to foul tasting and smelling water for a while.
"Carnot"
Time to install a filter system at home; one solids filter, followed in line by a taste and odour filter.
The first has a replaceable fibre core; the second uses diatomaceous earth. In general; a very effective system.
  C2 Junior Train Controller

If I was PM I would use work for the Dole to do CFA work like Back Burns , rubbish removal , fuel reduction by picking up and pulling out at the roots foreign flora. This activity is vital in our country. We need National. Service Fire Fighters.
  michaelgm Chief Commissioner

Sydneysiders are just going to have to get used to foul tasting and smelling water for a while.
Time to install a filter system at home; one solids filter, followed in line by a taste and odour filter.
The first has a replaceable fibre core; the second uses diatomaceous earth. In general; a very effective system.
Been watching this https://www.rfs.nsw.gov.au/fire-information/fires-near-me as I have relation quite close to the Gospers Mountain fire, which has been burning for months.

Curiosity the outline for the fire at Warragamba, appears only spasmodically.

Have heard from someone in the water industry, expansion of desal capacity is being seriously considered, new sites are being looked at.
  justapassenger Minister for Railways

The current fires in WA have resulted in the first WA deployment of the Coulson Aviation 737 Fireliner. The plane was flown from RAAF Richmond to RAAF Pearce overnight, where it will be on standby until at least tomorrow night.

I believe this is the first time it has been sent interstate from NSW to sit on standby without a planned drop, as the normal method of an interstate deployment is for it to fly in and drop fire retardant immediately without first landing locally.

It has now served in every state of Australia already this season. Finally somebody has remembered that states other than NSW do pay their share of the National Aerial Firefighting Centre budget.

If I was PM I would use work for the Dole to do CFA work like Back Burns , rubbish removal , fuel reduction by picking up and pulling out at the roots foreign flora. This activity is vital in our country. We need National. Service Fire Fighters.
C2
The government is currently looking at phasing out WFTD, at least in its current punitive form where it is only an inconvenience and doesn't do anything to develop work ready skills. They are currently doing a trial in a few employment service regions of a new structure where WFTD will no longer being compulsory.

The original idea behind WFTD was that long term unemployed people would get to 'practice' working and get some worthwhile experience, while not-for-profit organisations would get some free labour. The big flaw in this is that people who are in the system long enough to be forced to do WFTD are those who don't want to work (so why would they suddenly start being productive when they are on WFTD?) or people with disabilities who the system should have placed on disability support instead of the dole. People who are able and willing to work are not on WFTD, they get jobs or pass their mutual obligation requirements with training courses and volunteer work that they select proactively.

With that in mind, I reckon using WFTD people in fire prevention would not be a winning move because it simply wouldn't get done.

I can see merit in the idea of a National Service program of some sort, which would be able to put people to all sorts of work - including fuel load reduction in bushfire prone areas but also other areas. I reckon this would be better with young people at high school graduation age though, not shiftless dole bludgers. Give an exemption to those who enter university to study a proper professional degree (subject to them maintaining good grades) or take up a trade and make good progress through their apprenticeship.
  RTT_Rules Oliver Bullied, CME

Location: Dubai UAE
Desal uses huge amounts of electricity, and the plant did need a big rebuild after it was smashed by a tornado a few years back.

Sydneysiders are just going to have to get used to foul tasting and smelling water for a while.

On the topic of Sydney and bushfires, they have had some bad ones over the years, such as November 1951: https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/45775788
Carnot
Desal has its place and its place is growing with more and more countries resorting to Desal.

There is a bit of energy involves, but pumping water 100km is not a free lunch either if energy is factored in.
Dubai is 100% Desal and water costs are $3.00/kL (for first 6000 IG), Sydney is $2.24/kL.

The problem in Sydney and I suspect they will do it again is they don't think big picture. If the desal plant had been coupled to the Closed Cycle Gas Turbine (CCGT) plant, then the bulk of the energy to make the water is actually waste heat and at the same time you make power for the state, something NSW is short on and basically permanently imports. This is how nearly all the Middle East makes water and power. Sydney will need a continuous supply of additional water very soon, so time to think big. Oh wait they are building a CCGT to partly replace Liddell Power station, guess what no desal plant, again!

The water won't taste foul, be surprised if anyone even notices.
  Carnot Minister for Railways

Poor tasting and smelling water will be more to do with ash and mud in the dams.

I wonder if there's been much research on the affects of high concentrations of Boron which is often an issue with Desal water?
  lsrailfan Chief Commissioner

Location: Somewhere you're not
The fire at Gosper's Mountain has been upgraded to an Emergency Level Warning tonight, also the Green Wattle Creek fire has been upgraded to a Watch and Act.
  wobert Chief Commissioner

Location: Half way between Propodolla and Kinimakatka
Well these people definitely noticed       https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2019/dec/12/bushfires-and-drought-leave-nsw-town-of-tenterfield-without-clean-water-for-72-days

and Sydneys water supply is down to 40 odd % and dropping fast.
  Carnot Minister for Railways

There might be some difficulties supplying power to the Desal if the Mt Piper power station is impacted by bushfires:
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-12-17/nsw-rfs-worried-bushfire-could-hit-power-station-and-coal-mine/11805432

So much convergence of everything really....
  wobert Chief Commissioner
  lsrailfan Chief Commissioner

Location: Somewhere you're not
A state wide TFB has been announced for the whole of N.S.W from midnight tonight, until midnight on Saturday night, that is because of really hot and windy conditions on Thursday and Saturday respectively.
  Trans-Siberian Station Master

Location: Krasnoyarsk, Siberia
A state wide TFB has been announced for the whole of N.S.W from midnight tonight, until midnight on Saturday night, that is because of really hot and windy conditions on Thursday and Saturday respectively.
lsrailfan

Federal & State Government Emergency Coordination needs to get REAL, EFFECTIVE multi-role aircraft that can perform water bombing of fires, offshore patrol and Search & rescue operations.

Enter....Beriev Be-200 Altair - which can scoop up 12 metric tonnes of water in 14 seconds, operate from either a runway or open water - since 2004 has been water bombing fires in - Russia of course, Italy, Portugal, Greece, Serbia, Israel, Indonesia; Chile has ordered seven (7).

Perhaps....soon to be coming to Australia...courtesy of - Seaplane Global Air Services & and Airbus (builders); and International Emergency Services (wet & dry-lease operator)



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RTsqp9LKEoo
  michaelgm Chief Commissioner

There might be some difficulties supplying power to the Desal if the Mt Piper power station is impacted by bushfires:
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-12-17/nsw-rfs-worried-bushfire-could-hit-power-station-and-coal-mine/11805432

So much convergence of everything really....
Carnot
Just looked at the RFS website, link posted earlier.
Not only is Piper, Wang and Springvale a concern, fire is not far from Clarence pit now.
Bells line of road closed.
Potential for this to become particularly nasty.
  Carnot Minister for Railways

There might be some difficulties supplying power to the Desal if the Mt Piper power station is impacted by bushfires:
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-12-17/nsw-rfs-worried-bushfire-could-hit-power-station-and-coal-mine/11805432

So much convergence of everything really....
Just looked at the RFS website, link posted earlier.
Not only is Piper, Wang and Springvale a concern, fire is not far from Clarence pit now.
Bells line of road closed.
Potential for this to become particularly nasty.
michaelgm
Wallerawang has been shut since 2014.  Mt Piper and the large stockpiles of coal there are of real concern.

I have friends and relatives in the area, and some have decided to live elsewhere until the threat is over.

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