The China Problem

 
  doyle Deputy Commissioner

He could always lay hands on the Chinese, that might work to our advantage.....



No it won't

He is not fit to be prime minister

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  don_dunstan Dr Beeching

Location: Adelaide proud
Labor are far too close to the Chinese Communist Party - only recently we saw Opposition Foreign Affairs Spokesman Penny Wong telling a Senate inquiry only last week that we needed to shut up about the CCP's human rights record in order to keep the trade relationship with them sweet.

Can anyone name a single instance in human history where sucking up to a dictatorship has ever worked out? Yet there are people in this country who seriously believe that its the correct strategy.
  doyle Deputy Commissioner

The correct strategy is to pull away from China quickly and quietly without any aggravation.
  doyle Deputy Commissioner

Come on these liberals don't do diplomacy they are dangerous,

WE also need to publicly fund our political parties, NO DONATIONS
  Carnot Minister for Railways

China are already involved in a "Grey War" with us which involves buying property, political influence, cyber-espionage, diplomatic bullying, trade restrictions and so forth.

We need to disconnect, and disconnect fast where it hurts them.  They are desperate for our Natural resources which has a double-edged sword.  Either we restrict access to our iron ore for example which would destroy our economy OR be silent about the abuses of the CCP and let them pillage it.

Doing the former may provoke kinetic war.  Doing the later will have them just walk all over us and everybody else anyway.
  djf01 Chief Commissioner

The correct strategy is to pull away from China quickly and quietly without any aggravation.
doyle

I completely agree.  The question is how far and how fast.  

Complete disengagement (which we seem to be trying to provoke them into initiating) would be a disastrous mistake IMHO.

There are significant commercial and security advantages in accepting Chinese investment in Australia.  Holding a substantial amount of Chinese money hostage, that in the event of trade embargos or open hostilities they would never see again, is not without merit.  It's why threats to tear up the Port of Darwin lease are nuts IMHO.

That said, we do need to mitigate the increasing sovereign risk of doing business with China, but IMHO we need to do so without becoming an unreliable business partner ourselves.
  doyle Deputy Commissioner

Australia has also dropped the ball with our pacific neighbours

And defence... we would last 10 minutes. Australia has had well over 200 years to build a PROPER defence system instead we sold them farms and mines ect.. absolute lunacy

I tells ya we be stupid country

Possibly a nuke on any of our cities just to show the good ol us of a don't F U C K with us


I
  doyle Deputy Commissioner

Sorry guys Ive had 4 bottom front teeth ripped out today on pain relief, could end up raving I can't stand liberals and the ineptitude can't I can't stand any political party today

Scroto     fruit cake lier
Muppet Dutton.      war monger
Angas Taylor d I c k he ad
Tudge      
Reynolds.    Fool
Greg hunt (say it quickly)
Lamming. Idiot
Porter   private school boy elitist
Doffus tehan
Payne     token female
Colbec     lazy

All complete f u c k ING morons
No policies 3 years is the future from these
a r s e h o l e s

Labor suckling up too the ccp

No vision for Australia

Arrgh
  BrentonGolding Chief Commissioner

Location: Maldon Junction
The correct strategy is to pull away from China quickly and quietly without any aggravation.

I completely agree.  The question is how far and how fast.  

Complete disengagement (which we seem to be trying to provoke them into initiating) would be a disastrous mistake IMHO.

There are significant commercial and security advantages in accepting Chinese investment in Australia.  Holding a substantial amount of Chinese money hostage, that in the event of trade embargos or open hostilities they would never see again, is not without merit.  It's why threats to tear up the Port of Darwin lease are nuts IMHO.

That said, we do need to mitigate the increasing sovereign risk of doing business with China, but IMHO we need to do so without becoming an unreliable business partner ourselves.
djf01
Very well said however the last line in your post beggars the question what do we do about the fact that China is already an unreliable business partner?

Companies cannot make decisions going forward regards trade with the big red dragon with the level of uncertainty (known as political risk in economic circles if I remember correctly) that is now becoming more and more apparent with the rise of China.

So what, our trade with them becomes a one way street? We continue to import mountains of useless junk from China to fill Bunnings and other such stores but we don't export anything to them because of the chance that they will simply stop it at the border and make up some excuse for why the import of such widgets is now subject to a 100 > 200% tariff or that said widgets are contaminated with the latest made up bug or beetle?

A one way trading relationship is not a relationship and I think many if not most Australian exporters will have lost their appetite for trade with China over the last year or so. Apart from Iron Ore of course.......
  Carnot Minister for Railways

The correct strategy is to pull away from China quickly and quietly without any aggravation.

I completely agree.  The question is how far and how fast.  

Complete disengagement (which we seem to be trying to provoke them into initiating) would be a disastrous mistake IMHO.

There are significant commercial and security advantages in accepting Chinese investment in Australia.  Holding a substantial amount of Chinese money hostage, that in the event of trade embargos or open hostilities they would never see again, is not without merit.  It's why threats to tear up the Port of Darwin lease are nuts IMHO.

That said, we do need to mitigate the increasing sovereign risk of doing business with China, but IMHO we need to do so without becoming an unreliable business partner ourselves.
Very well said however the last line in your post beggars the question what do we do about the fact that China is already an unreliable business partner?

Companies cannot make decisions going forward regards trade with the big red dragon with the level of uncertainty (known as political risk in economic circles if I remember correctly) that is now becoming more and more apparent with the rise of China.

So what, our trade with them becomes a one way street? We continue to import mountains of useless junk from China to fill Bunnings and other such stores but we don't export anything to them because of the chance that they will simply stop it at the border and make up some excuse for why the import of such widgets is now subject to a 100 > 200% tariff or that said widgets are contaminated with the latest made up bug or beetle?

A one way trading relationship is not a relationship and I think many if not most Australian exporters will have lost their appetite for trade with China over the last year or so. Apart from Iron Ore of course.......
BrentonGolding
Iron Ore is a case of Australia cashing in while we can, I suspect.  It would all come to a grinding halt if China got involved in a violent war.  And besides, they are keen to source Iron from other locations asap anyway (i.e. Brazil, Africa etc).
  djf01 Chief Commissioner

Iron Ore ...  It would all come to a grinding halt if China got involved in a violent war.  And besides, they are keen to source Iron from other locations asap anyway (i.e. Brazil, Africa etc).
Carnot
That's what Roosevelt said about oil and Japan in 1941.
  YM-Mundrabilla Minister for Railways

Location: Mundrabilla but I'd rather be in Narvik
The Chinese like arbitrary, split second, last minute decisions eg coal ships already enroute etc. Perhaps we should tear up, nationalise or otherwise revoke (whatever) their possession of the Port of Darwin.

Perhaps set up an exclusion zone across the shipping lanes into Darwin.
  Carnot Minister for Railways

Finally the EU grows a pair: https://www.politico.eu/article/eu-trade-chief-says-efforts-to-ratify-china-deal-suspended/

Btw, appeasement never works.  A friend who is a former senior diplomat told me he is genuinely concerned that war will occur, and that a Neville Chamberlain/Jacinda Ardern approach will bite you back hard.
  doyle Deputy Commissioner

Who in their right mind would want to appease them?

Pull away from China quickly and quietly without aggravation.and we need a proper vision for Australia

This may or may not win elections, it's definitely the best way to deal with China.
  djf01 Chief Commissioner

... appeasement never works.
Carnot

Mooning the school bully doesn't have a great track record either.
  bingley hall Minister for Railways

Location: Last train to Skaville
Finally the EU grows a pair: https://www.politico.eu/article/eu-trade-chief-says-efforts-to-ratify-china-deal-suspended/

Btw, appeasement never works.  A friend who is a former senior diplomat told me he is genuinely concerned that war will occur, and that a Neville Chamberlain/Jacinda Ardern approach will bite you back hard.
Carnot

Ho Chi Minh tried it with the Yanks too, and look how that turned out Razz
  doyle Deputy Commissioner
  YM-Mundrabilla Minister for Railways

Location: Mundrabilla but I'd rather be in Narvik
Finally the EU grows a pair: https://www.politico.eu/article/eu-trade-chief-says-efforts-to-ratify-china-deal-suspended/

Btw, appeasement never works.  A friend who is a former senior diplomat told me he is genuinely concerned that war will occur, and that a Neville Chamberlain/Jacinda Ardern approach will bite you back hard.
Carnot
I fear that this is a matter of not if but when.
1) Hong Kong.  2) Taiwan.  3) Australia.
Assuming that we haven't sold the country to them beforehand.
  don_dunstan Dr Beeching

Location: Adelaide proud
Sorry guys Ive had 4 bottom front teeth ripped out today on pain relief, could end up raving I can't stand liberals and the ineptitude can't I can't stand any political party today

Scroto     fruit cake lier
Muppet Dutton.      war monger
Angas Taylor d I c k he ad
Tudge      
Reynolds.    Fool
Greg hunt (say it quickly)
Lamming. Idiot
Porter   private school boy elitist
Doffus tehan
Payne     token female
Colbec     lazy

All complete f u c k ING morons
No policies 3 years is the future from these
a r s e h o l e s

Labor suckling up too the ccp

No vision for Australia

Arrgh
doyle
Dutton isn't really a war-monger, he's a realist. He can see what's coming despite the fact that nobody whatsoever (and very few in the LNP) apparently can.

You can't appease dictatorships. What they want for Australia is exactly what they have no in Hong Kong with no opposition whatsoever to their benevolent thuggery. Or else.
  Carnot Minister for Railways

Yet another example of the way the CCP silences and persecutes any dissenters, including those in Hong Kong:
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-05-06/hong-kong-activist-joshua-wong-sentenced-jail-vigil/100121506

Another shameful day.  Just for peacefully protesting about the Tiananmen Square massacre in HK gets you 10 months in the slammer.
  doyle Deputy Commissioner
  Carnot Minister for Railways

Serious question - do you think Australia would put up a decent fight against the PLA if they wanted to conquer us, or perhaps some of us (i.e the Pilbara)?

Would the Yanks bother to intervene (if they still had an operational military)?
  doyle Deputy Commissioner

Seriously we would last 10 minutes they won't take a bit they would take the lot, it would be ridiculous for them to take a region only

I wouldn't count on the yanks

Remember when Scroto kicked up a stink about the covid the yanks cashed in on some of our trade




World domination never works out,

I suppose we will see what happens to Taiwan right.?

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