The River - WHAT IS UP WITH THIS?

 
  Griffinrails Official Locomotive Driver

Location: Dunno. (help i'm lost)
Hello all
I've seen many things talking about a 2 car V set service from St Marys to Wyong
When was this?
When did it end?
What was frequency like?
What set did they use?
What cars did they use?
What cars are STILL in use?
Why was this service even made?
Why did the V set have a destination board?
How many V sets had destination boards?
Where are the cars now?
Are there any photos?
Are there any videos?

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  AheadMatthewawsome Train Controller

Location: thendesc
Hi Griffin, it might be a predecessor to the current 8 Car Oscars that go between Blacktown and Wyong via the North Shore. St Marys back then would have been a better option as the junction to the Ropes Creek branch.
  Griffinrails Official Locomotive Driver

Location: Dunno. (help i'm lost)
If I recall they wired up the mainline of the Ropes Creek Line (aka how far the current sidings go) so that they could turn the train around.
One of the cars was rebuilt from the Glenbrook disaster with goninan fluting. It's now at Maintrain, still abandoned.
  viaprojects Chief Train Controller

Hello all
I've seen many things talking about a 2 car V set service from St Marys to Wyong
Griffinrails Official

approx date ..afik  st marys has not been a turn around station for a long time .. would think blacktown to wyong is current as a 8 car set..
  AheadMatthewawsome Train Controller

Location: thendesc
If I recall they wired up the mainline of the Ropes Creek Line (aka how far the current sidings go) so that they could turn the train around.
One of the cars was rebuilt from the Glenbrook disaster with goninan fluting. It's now at Maintrain, still abandoned.
Griffinrails Official
So, from what I’m aware of. The 4 tracks that exist today only go to St Marys. Then what was supposed to happen is the 2 tracks would go to Penrith, and the other 2 go to Ropes Creek. After the sidings, the tracks did a curve around North St Marys to Dunheved. All that exists now is the rock cutting, some random sleepers and rails, the footbridge and the island platform for Dunheved. You used to be able to access the platforms via a staircase that was removed in 2011. In the future, they may use the site to connect the Metro North West, and Metro Western Sydney Airport lines. Making a loop around Sydney.

Cochrane station is now a roundabout for Ropes Crossing. Ropes Creek is now a park. It had 4 tracks with an island and 2 side platforms. All that’s left is the steel overhead wire arches for 4 tracks, very rusted and a bit melted points switches in the station building, and the inner tracks. The rest has been rebuilt for the park. Except for the side platforms, and the outer tracks. There’s also a footpath and clearing that won’t be built up to the shopping plaza where the tracks used to go. There’s now a recently completed suburb called Ropes Crossing around where Ropes Creek used to be. The area surrounding Dunheved hasn’t change much since it closed. All of that area is now served by Buses. Sadly, most of that area is basically the new Redfern. Redfern used to be a very dodgy place in the 80’s. This is mostly due to the stolen generation mahogany.
  AheadMatthewawsome Train Controller

Location: thendesc
Hello all
I've seen many things talking about a 2 car V set service from St Marys to Wyong

approx date ..afik  st marys has not been a turn around station for a long time .. would think blacktown to wyong is current as a 8 car set..
viaprojects
They (unless during a 3rd lockdown) normally have trains terminating trains during the peak. They also use St Marys to turn around trains during track work. They last did about a month or two ago.
  s3_gunzel Not a gunzel developer

Location: Western Sydney, AU
When was this?
Griffinrails Official
In the early 2000s.

When did it end?
Griffinrails Official
In the early-to-mid 2000s. It was very short lived.

What was frequency like?
Griffinrails Official
Terrible.

https://web.archive.org/web/20030923215406/http://www.cityrail.info/timetable/ttable.jsp?line=ws&day=wd&dir=dn
https://web.archive.org/web/20050710030244/http://www.cityrail.info/timetable/ttable.jsp?line=ws&day=wd&dir=up

One a day in each direction.

What set did they use?
Griffinrails Official
A 2 car V Set.

What cars did they use?
Griffinrails Official
Whatever was available.

Why did the V set have a destination board?
Griffinrails Official
Citydecker Project. Look it up.

it might be a predecessor to the current 8 Car Oscars that go between Blacktown and Wyong via the North Shore.
AheadMatthewawsome
Nope. That's not it at all. There was, in fact, a period where there were no trains from Western Sydney out to Wyong via either the Homebush Loop or the North Shore.
  Griffinrails Official Locomotive Driver

Location: Dunno. (help i'm lost)
Found an old webpage (as in REALLY old, before the M sets had even entered service) which had quite a lot of photos and information.
Apparently the 2 car V set was a DT series set, with DTM8034 and DTD9031. Anyone know if these are still in service? (obviously with different numbers though)
https://www.oocities.org/trendy_rechauffe/
Were there any other 2 car V sets?
  AheadMatthewawsome Train Controller

Location: thendesc
Found an old webpage (as in REALLY old, before the M sets had even entered service) which had quite a lot of photos and information.
Apparently the 2 car V set was a DT series set, with DTM8034 and DTD9031. Anyone know if these are still in service? (obviously with different numbers though)
https://www.oocities.org/trendy_rechauffe/
Were there any other 2 car V sets?
Griffinrails Official
Having a look at the website (which is safe and hasn't been taken over by free lanced terrorists "Not on my shift! KAWAH!"), it's a true treasure trove! They show some proposals to what the V Sets and the Tangara could have looked like with a different manufacturer. They also show the mock up of the Millennium Train from 1999! It shows what I believe was another name for Rosehill-Camellia apart of the Parramatta Rail Link, called Rosehill Gardens! They also show several charter trips, and the old Tulloch carriages being restored by HET! If the website ever shuts down, I have some photos from my Pinterest (unless if they close down Pinterest) showing these photos here: https://www.pinterest.com.au/aheadmatthewawsome/sydney-trains/
  s3_gunzel Not a gunzel developer

Location: Western Sydney, AU
It shows what I believe was another name for Rosehill-Camellia apart of the Parramatta Rail Link, called Rosehill Gardens!
AheadMatthewawsome
Without prejudice - Rosehill Gardens is the name of the racecourse precinct.

In fact, at one point, the station was named Rosehill Racecourse - and indeed - in the old S Set Destination File is 'Rosehill Gardens Race Course'.
  M636C Minister for Railways

I caught  "The River" from West Ryde to Hornsby one day.
I was walking up to the station on the west side when I heard a train arriving.
I ran to the platform and jumped on the train.
I ended up in the power car, which was trailing.

The car was DIM 8020, the rebuilt car.
It had been repainted grey inside (I think it had been wood grain pattern on the end walls)

I got a photo of it leaving Hornsby.
I didn't get the number of the driving trailer.

Peter
  sunnyyan Station Master

Trains can still terminate at St Marys from both directions. Up trains regularly terminate there during trackwork. Down trains don't regularly terminate there (I think the peak services actually continue empty to Penrith Yard), but it is possible.

I think The River was introduced to speed up the trip for any commuters working in Western Sydney but living on the Central Coast. I don't think many people actually commute like this. I also read somewhere that it was difficult to cross the Down Main North at Strathfield to join the freight line.


As for the current Wyong-North Shore-Blacktown services, I'm not sure about them. I suspect they're probably just to give commuters a direct train to North Sydney/Wynyard/Town Hall and that the extension to Blacktown is just because Blacktown is a good place to stable the train. I think if there was actually demand for a Central Coast-Western Sydney service, they'd resume The River, as the dive at North Strathfield now removes the problem with crossing the Down Main North.
  DCook Chief Train Controller

Location: The standard state
Found an old webpage (as in REALLY old, before the M sets had even entered service) which had quite a lot of photos and information.
Apparently the 2 car V set was a DT series set, with DTM8034 and DTD9031. Anyone know if these are still in service? (obviously with different numbers though)
https://www.oocities.org/trendy_rechauffe/
Were there any other 2 car V sets?
Griffinrails Official
I'm certain that all the DT series carriages were retired and scrapped in 2005 as a result of rust being discovered in their mild steel underframes.

Only one carriage (forgot the number) survived, it was retained at the Petersham Training College for several years before being given to the military and destroyed during terrorism prevention training, I think railway digest did a small article on it in 2008-2010.

Edit- I was confusing the first batch of carriages with the later second batch.

As for what carriages were used, it really depended on whatever was available. Most sources that I have read state that carriage DIM 8020 was primarily used, along with an old driving trailer.

The carriages that had a destination board can be easily distinguished by the different style of headlights that are positioned higher up and are flatter on top.
  s3_gunzel Not a gunzel developer

Location: Western Sydney, AU
I'm certain that all the DT series carriages were retired and scrapped in 2005 as a result of rust being discovered in their mild steel underframes.
DCook
Close. One pair survives. I’m sure one of the cars is DTM 8036.
  Griffinrails Official Locomotive Driver

Location: Dunno. (help i'm lost)
Wondering where that pair is, probably Maintrain.
Also, I'm pretty sure that there is only 1 ex. desto V set out there. V27 I think?
  s3_gunzel Not a gunzel developer

Location: Western Sydney, AU
Wondering where that pair is, probably Maintrain.


In service, on V21 I believe.
  DCook Chief Train Controller

Location: The standard state
Unless consists have changed since 11/2/20, the pair of DTM 8036 and an unrecorded DTD driving trailer is in service on V21 along with a somewhat similar pairing of a DCT and DCM. I don't have the numbers for any other carriages as I (rather stupidly) only recorded the carriage types, not the numbers.

Similarly, I can confirm that one (or both) DIM series power car on V27 has the indicator board modification, however that was recorded on the same day, hence I do not have a carriage number.
  s3_gunzel Not a gunzel developer

Location: Western Sydney, AU
DTM 8036 - DTD 9036 - DCT - DCM on V21.
  theanimal Chief Commissioner



approx date ..afik  st marys has not been a turn around station for a long time .. would think blacktown to wyong is current as a 8 car set..
viaproject
The stone train from Peppertree still terminates at St marys on the down before returning to Rooty Hill?
  Cubologist Station Staff



approx date ..afik  st marys has not been a turn around station for a long time .. would think blacktown to wyong is current as a 8 car set..
The stone train from Peppertree still terminates at St marys on the down before returning to Rooty Hill?
theanimal
Kind of. It runs up the stub of the Ropes Creek branch and returns from there.
  alleve Station Master

Location: T4 Illawarra Line
I'm pretty curious about the V Set destos. Were all of the V Sets given destos, or just some? The V Sets operating today don't have destos - is this because they had them removed again, or because the V Sets with destos were taken out of service and the V Sets currently used were never given them? If some V Sets were given destos and then had them removed, why? Why not just leave them installed?
  viaprojects Chief Train Controller

I'm pretty curious about the V Set destos. Were all of the V Sets given destos, or just some?
alleve
it was tested on a limited number of V sets . just like the testing before new upgrades / new sets for the Sydney network .. ie shows the age of the V sets ...
  KRviator Moderator

Location: Up the front
I'm pretty curious about the V Set destos. Were all of the V Sets given destos, or just some? The V Sets operating today don't have destos - is this because they had them removed again, or because the V Sets with destos were taken out of service and the V Sets currently used were never given them? If some V Sets were given destos and then had them removed, why? Why not just leave them installed?
alleve
From the ARHS book Sydney's Electric Trains:
For a while, the 'Citidecker' program resulted in several V Set power cars being fitted with dot-matrix illuminated destination boards, as were fitted to numerous suburban EMU power cars. The retrofitted indicators have since been removed from these intercity trains, and cover panels have been applied where they used to be.
ARHS NSW
There doesn't appear to be a reference for which cars were so fitted, and which weren't.
  Griffinrails Official Locomotive Driver

Location: Dunno. (help i'm lost)
Well, now there's even less of a reference seeing as the Maintrain Vs are all gone now.
I wonder if any desto V sets were classified WITHOUT the DT change and stayed at DJ, DI, DC, etc.
  s3_gunzel Not a gunzel developer

Location: Western Sydney, AU
Well, now there's even less of a reference seeing as the Maintrain Vs are all gone now.
I wonder if any desto V sets were classified WITHOUT the DT change and stayed at DJ, DI, DC, etc.
Griffinrails Official
There is at least one in service still.

DJM and DKM cars never got them. One or two DIMs did, but not many more than that I don’t believe.

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